Air Serbia winter network revelead
Air Serbia is today expected put on sale flights for its 2013/14 winter season, launching October 27, and the 2014 summer season, which begins on March 30 next year. The airline’s schedule and pricing should come into effect next week. Within the next few days tickets should be offered for sale via the airline’s website and the public Amadeus website. By launching its winter and summer season with promotional low fares, the airline hopes to attract new customers and put pressure on the competition.
As is outlined in the table below, Air Serbia will launch new destinations with flights to Abu Dhabi, Banja Luka, Prague and Bucharest this winter. From March 30, 2014, the Serbian carrier will inaugurate services to Beirut, Cairo, Kiev, Sofia, Varna, Budapest and Warsaw. Highlights in the 2013/14 winter schedule include double daily flights to Athens, Moscow, Paris, Podgorica, Vienna and Zurich. The airline is also considerably boosting frequencies on other destinations including Brussels, Tel Aviv, Stuttgart, Thessaloniki, Tivat, Stockholm and Copenhagen. In the table below, equipment changes have also been highlighted. Flights to Sarajevo, Skopje and Podgorica will all be upgraded from turboprop aircraft to the Airbus A319. As a result, one of the three daily flights to Podgorica (which operated last season) will be discontinued.
Air Serbia has also changed flight numbers on all of its destinations with exception to London Heathrow. Furthermore, the airline has changed slots at most airports with exception to its traditional landing and departure times at London and Moscow. Airlines that will be particularly hit by the added competition include Olympic Air which will face a tough ask trying to shrug off the 21 weekly flights which will be offered between Belgrade and Greece by Air Serbia with jet engine aircraft this winter. Austrian will also see tough competition on its Varna service next summer. Thanks to a monopoly on the market, Austrian’s sky high prices from Varna will be in trouble especially since Air Serbia has timed its flights from the seaside town so as to connect on to its western European services from Belgrade. Furthermore, TAROM and Adria Airways will lose the monopoly on their respective services to the Serbian capital. Larger aircraft and the general hype surrounding the newly branded Serbian carrier will also force Montenegro Airlines to rethink its strategy to its busiest market.
Below you can view Air Serbia’s official winter timetable. It follows a long week during which Jat Airways and Etihad Airways worked around the clock to finalise the price structure and load the new flights into the system. All passengers which have already booked their tickets on Jat Airways/Air Serbia this winter will be informed of flight number changes and issued new tickets in the following weeks. Keep in mind that the frequencies shown for the winter 2012/13 season were those officially announced but, due to a chronic fleet shortage, the airline cancelled hundreds of flights.
| Destination | Frequency W13/14 | Frequency W12/13 | Change | Equipment | Remarks |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Abu Dhabi | 4 | 0 | ▲ 4 | A319 | NEW, starts OCT27 |
| Athens | 14 | 6 | ▲ 8 | B737 (until NOV23) A319 (from NOV24) | |
| Amesterdam | 7 | 7 | - | B737 (until DEC21) A319 (from DEC22) | |
| Banja Luka | 7 | 0 | ▲ 7 | ATR72 | NEW, starts DEC01 |
| Brussels | 7 | 2 | ▲ 5 | B737/A319 | A319 enters BRU service on selected days from DEC31 |
| Berlin | 7 | 4 | ▲ 3 | B737 (until NOV23) A319 (from NOV24) | |
| Bucharest | 7 | 0 | ▲ 7 | ATR72 | NEW, starts DEC09 |
| Copenhagen | 7 | 3 | ▲ 4 | B737/A319 | A319 enters CPH service on selected days from OCT29 |
| Dusseldorf | 7 | 6 | ▲ 1 | B737 (until NOV23) A319 (from NOV24) | |
| Frankfurt | 7 | 7 | - | B737 (until DEC28) A319 (from DEC29) | |
| Istanbul | 7 | 4 | ▲ 3 | B737 (until DEC28) A319 (from DEC29) | |
| Larnaca | 4 | 2 | ▲ 2 | B737 (until NOV15) A319 (from NOV17) | |
| London Heathrow | 7 | 7 | - | B737 (until DEC07) A319 (from DEC08) | |
| Ljubljana | 7 | 0 | ▲ 7 | ATR72 | NEW, starts DEC09 |
| Milan | 7 | 4 | ▲ 3 | B737/A319 | A319 enters MXP service on selected days from DEC10 |
| Moscow | 14 | 7 | ▲ 7 | B737 (one daily flight until NOV29) A319 (from OCT27) | both flights with A319 from NOV30 |
| Paris | 14 | 7 | ▲ 7 | B737 (until NOV16) A319 (from NOV17) | |
| Prague | 7 | 0 | ▲ 7 | ATR72 | NEW, starts DEC01 |
| Podgorica | 14 | 21 | ▼ 7 | ATR72 (one daily flight) B737 (until NOV16) A319 (from NOV17) | |
| Rome | 7 | 5 | ▲ 2 | B737/A319 | A319 enters FCO service on selected days from DEC08 |
| Sarajevo | 7 | 7 | - | ATR72 (until DEC08) B737 (DEC09 - FEB28) A319 (from MAR01) | |
| Skopje | 7 | 7 | - | ATR72 (until NOV30) B737 (DEC01 - DEC21) A319 (from DEC22) | |
| Stuttgart | 7 | 3 | ▲ 4 | B737 (until NOV30) A319 (from DEC01) | |
| Stockholm | 7 | 3 | ▲ 4 | B737 (until DEC22) A319 (from DEC23) | |
| Tivat | 11 | 7 | ▲ 4 | ATR72 | |
| Tel Aviv | 7 | 2 | ▲ 5 | B737 (until NOV30) A319 (from DEC01) | direct flight, no longer stops in LCA |
| Thessaloniki | 7 | 3 | ▲ 4 | B737 (until NOV09) A319 (from NOV10) | |
| Vienna | 14 | 14 | - | ATR72 | |
| Zurich | 14 | 7 | ▲ 7 | B737 (until NOV09) A319 (from NOV10) |
Comments
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I think we were expecting something WOW.
ReplyDeleteWell done AIR SERBIA! 263 flight on time table for winter season. New aircraft, 39 return a day. No too bed start for young ER SRBIJA. All who which to traveling is welcome on board!
DeleteNo question, AIR SERBIA know how.
Old airline in phase of resurrection!
All airlines fly for only one reason.
To welcoming and serving passengers and cargo business. From spring time Griffith, Australia many greeting
Rodney Marinkovic,Aircraft Mechanical Engineer (ret.)
243 weekly operations / 14 aircraft ?
DeleteProjected pax of 1.67 million in 2014, if all goes well and airline has 13 aircrafts in operation (10?Airbus 319, and 3 ATR42. Although i think 1.3 million is more likely if all goes well.
Not Atr 42 but 72, and not 3 but 5 of them unless they retire 2 ;) Btw is that your personal projection or somebody else's?
DeleteCan we get some new news about a different airline except Jat/Air Serbia all the time...what's going on with Croatia Airlines or B&H Airlines and Adria...haven't heard anything about them in a while....always Jat/Air Serbia now....and its mostly repeating the same things over and over
ReplyDeletePerhaps you should review news published during the week to find out whats happening in those airlines.
DeleteNice to see nearly all Jat's destionations doubling the frequencies as Air Serbia compared to winter 2012/13, except TGD going from 3 to 2 daily flights.
ReplyDeleteLooks pretty good to me!
Can't wait for them to start flying on October 27 and to have opportunity to actually fly with them soon, and see their new product
Good luck Air Serbia!
How disappointing. Not exactly WOW is it.
ReplyDelete- Euro destinations with large Serb populations
Delete- former Yugo regions with sizeable Serb populations
- newly established Middle Eastern trade links
- some feeder traffic for Etihad ?
The plan is to transport Serb citizens to and from the Belgrade hub as befits a national carrier. It'not disappointing, it's quite logical actually.
Yes, it´s logical, but at the same time it seems like exactly the same kind of business that has ruined Malev, Croatia Airlines, Balkan, MAT, JAT... only with few more push ups. A company that relaies on "Gastarbeiter"-transportaion, a population whose interest to visit Serbia shrincks from month to month, doesn´t hava a future.
DeleteAll of those airlines you mentioned did not have the backing of a Middle Eastern giant and they were all crippled by their local government.
DeleteFurthermore, can you please provide us with your source that proves your argument that more and more 'gasterbajteri' lose interest to visit Serbia. Thanks.
He's being disingenuous knowing full well that we are talking about modern third generation families that don't live too far away and are traveling for a whole host of reason ranging from family visits to business and holidays.
DeleteMany of our former Yugo neighbours still exhibit a 1990s mindset. It's 2013 not 1990.
Everyone who has relatives in Germany or France knows that effect. There are many Gastarbeiters of first generation who have already died, or don´t have their parents in Serbia to visit any more, or are just having their own chlidren in the new country married with some foreign girls and guys, or enjoy gardening in Serbia after retiremnts. On the other hand, the second and third generation, born out there in Germany, Austria, France had to some extend visited Serbia in chlide´s and teen age, but many of them don´t speak Sebian language fluently, and rather try to make a focus of their life abroad with no many thoughts about Serbia. There are allways different types ofcourse, but in total the number of Gastarbeiter traveling to Serbia is rapidly shrincking. Many bus operators have already canceled their opperations.
DeleteIt´s a normal part of life. It wasn´t a critic on people´s behaviour. Backing from the middle east has nothing to with the fact that the number of passangers that are targeted is rapidly shrincking.
I have to admit that I´m disappointed to some extand. Etihad and JAT didn´t use a chance to build out a regional company in the region that is so urging to have one serious regional player. Many people here found excuses for that, they talked about some "different" business model. And now, afterall we see that they are pushing the old "ima nasih ljudi"-concept, which doesn´t relay on any hard facts, and rather just reflect some national imagination and business-thinking incopetency of Serbian people who made Etihad believe that "Serbian emigration" is profitable focus group. Sorry! It perhaps worms up some feelings, but has nothing to do with rational choice.
I am sorry but have you by any chance visited places like Vienna, Zurich or Dusseldorf? Large areas of these cities or even the regions within which they are located could be depicted as mini-Serbia. Especially Austria. Just look at the amount of Serbian clubs across Austria, Switzerland and southern Germany.
DeleteDon't forget that Serbian diaspora is very nationalistic especially in Austria, Canada, Australia and around Chicago. For the love of God there is an exact replica of Gracanica in Illinois!
The phenomenon you are depicting is just not there, at least not yet.
'Many bus operators have already canceled their opperations.'
DeleteThat could be more a result of an increased number of flights from Belgrade to diaspora layers. Especially since Wizz Air entered the market.
We are talking about a trend that is older than the LCC. The reasons are obvious. If you don´t have your old parents in Serbia, maybe dying, you will have no real interest to go to Serbia. If you are young, perhaps it makes fun to make a party in Serbia during the holliday, but when you get married, when you find a serious job there is a way less interest.
DeleteDon't forget that Serbian diaspora is very nationalistic especially in Austria, Canada, Australia and around Chicago. For the love of God there is an exact replica of Gracanica in Illinois!
DeleteThe phenomenon you are depicting is just not there, at least not yet.
___
Oh, please, give me a brake. I have some relatives in Australia. Very national, quit in a good economical situation. They haven´t visited Serbia for 25 years - no one of them. Also some relatives in Chicago. There are many "Serbs" there who never saw Sebia in their whole life. My old relatives, ca. 70 years old, are trying to come to visit once in two years. They are having two children, the one was visiting Serbia 10 years ago, the another one didn´t travel to Serbia since 30 years. And they are all big nationalists. -
I don´t want to make accusations on anybody. People should live the way thay find it comfortable and best. But at the same time a serious airliner and business must aknowlagde those realistic lifestyles and not build out a strategy on the emotional base.
AnonymousSeptember 1, 2013 at 11:20 AM
Delete'Many bus operators have already canceled their opperations.'
That could be more a result of an increased number of flights from Belgrade to diaspora layers. Especially since Wizz Air entered the market.
___
You cannot be serious. Gastarbeiters, once they decide to travel, are having more luggage than WizzAir can transport in a month.
Air Serbia is already regional company with it's hub at Nikola Tesla Belgrade airport. The region being Europe. Europe is a relatively small geographical area with a dense population.
DeleteYou display a serious obsession with the former Yugoslavia market which is well covered by Air Serbia. You still refer to them as JAT for some reason.
Don´t be silly. A regional company is only a company that actually serves direct - otu of hub - flights from the region. Air Serbia is flying regionally, but in order to be a regional company you have to build out bases in the region. Like Adria or Wizzair.
DeleteYou display a serious obsession with the former Yugoslavia market which is well covered by Air Serbia. You still refer to them as JAT for some reason.
Delete____
I actually never reffered to the ex Yugoslavian market, and I don´t believe that there is an ex-yu market. Rather than that, the whole Southeast Europe, with Belgrade being in it´s very centre, must be regarded as one market for the purposes of aviation business.
When I say JAT I reffear to the company that is currently existing, and that will be as suched rebranded to Air Serbia. JAT with Etihad is doing plans for brand and routs of Air Serbia.
+1
DeleteNaturally as JU is the only significant EXYU carrier to see improve. Time for articles dedicated to CTN would be after it goes belly up in the near future, two or three of them I suggest. Later EXYU might consider some vintage articles reviving selected older news from CTN's teenage time.
ReplyDeleteB&H is rather virtual airline than real, useless to speak about. Adria might be mentioned after its name changes to Albanian and that's it.
B&H were the only airline to register a profit this year
Deleteit´s something like saying that unlike the mcdonalds the pizzeria around the corner made some profit.
DeleteAdria might be mentioned after its name changes to Albanian and that's it. - I like this one and i guess agree with it.
DeleteQuite a stupid comment. Adria seems to be the only airliner in the region that is seriously using the advantages of open sky and understanding that post-yu countries are to small for making an exclusevly national air business. If they open bases in Kosovo, in Albania, perhaps soon in Bosnia, it wan´t mae them "Albanian airlines" or "Bosnia airways". They will stay Adria in any sense, and that was also the only rational option for JAT - to put some neutral branding and open bases around the region.
DeleteYou are completely wrong...and quite boring with your 100 comments per day outcry about Air Serbia not opening bases accross the region. Take it easy.
DeleteActually, Adria is not making the best use of the Open Skies because they are incapable of making a profit. It seems they are doing some wrong, so they are not to be used a role model for others.
DeleteYou are completely wrong...and quite boring with your 100 comments per day outcry about Air Serbia not opening bases accross the region. Take it easy.
Delete---------------------------------------------
He thinks it's 1990. He has problem with the word 'Serbia'.
Friendly, this is what people call irrony. I have no problem with word "Serbia", "Croatia", "Hungary" or "Yugoslavia". Country names are fine, but to make mini country-national airlines business, that has nothing to do with the year 2013. This is exectly a strategy of 1990, and it takes some basic logic to see that I´m against making the aviation business in the 1990 style, and not viceversa.
DeleteActually, Adria is not making the best use of the Open Skies because they are incapable of making a profit. It seems they are doing some wrong, so they are not to be used a role model for others.
Delete__
Perhaps they don´t make profit in total, but a base in Pristina brings some very easy money for the airliner. That´s why they are expanding to Tirana now.
Every flight brings in money, the only question is if it is enough to cover the expenses. In Adria's case it is not.
DeleteFriendly, this is what people call irrony. I have no problem with word "Serbia", "Croatia", "Hungary" or "Yugoslavia". Country names are fine, but to make mini country-national airlines business
Delete---
And yet, we fly American Airlines, British Airways, Air France, or comparing to them, newly established Qatar, Emirates, Turkish... Actually, I'm having trouble identifying large and successful airlines without some kind of designation of their country of origin.
Also, people are smarter than you give them credit for. You think they will choose a Serbian airline, owned by the Serbian Government, with Serbian flag on the fuselage - but god forbid it should be called "Air Serbia"? I'm betting that they will actually look into hard product, flexibility, schedule and price. Some might avoid it altogether due to personal or political reasons, but the name itself won't make a difference, and these people would be a very small minority.
I'm not saying Air Serbia is the best name ever - actually, I preferred Jat - or that JU will join the likes of QR, EK or TK. It's just that I don't think this particular name will have any impact on airline's business in the exYU region. None whatsoever.
Well if you concider USA, UK, France to be a mini countries, than you have certainly missed the point. No need to discuss on Air Serbia brand and its failing to give some regional opportunities to the airline again. Just don´t be so sure that people in the region are generally smart when making decisions. A customer of an ideal marketing strategy is not a "smart customer", anyway. It is a seductive customer.
DeleteWell, no, but I do consider Qatar and United Arab Emirates mini countries, yet that doesn't stop them running three very successful airlines, two called after that very same mini countries, and the third also in a way (Etihad is Union in Arabic, as in UAE). I'm just saying that being from a small country doesn't really have much to do with naming your airline. What about Singapore, or Cathay (China)?
DeleteAnd I get your point, but where we differ is that I believe customers here will decide upon one criteria, followed by another: price and schedule. I don't think they will give a second thought to the name, which by the way explains why WizzAir or RyanAir are so popular.
I have hard time believing that a person would fly an airline with a neutral name, knowing that it's Serbian, via Belgrade, the capital of Serbia, with Serbian crew and probably a lot of Serbian pax - but would have a problem with the airline being called Air Serbia. It's no secret where the airline comes from.
Right to the point. My thoughts were the same.
DeleteUAE based airliners and Singapore airlines are company who base they entire business and glory on the fact that for decades Europe could not be connected with Southeast Asia and Australia without a stop. And even if some destinations nowdays perhaps can be served with Boeing dreamliner, it´s still far more confortable for passangers to have to long flights than one monster flight.
DeleteSo, this is the whole caluclation with the business of Emirats, Etihad and Qatar. Not difficult to see that Belgrade is not nearly having such a geographical position, although its position is not bad, and it´s probably one of best in Europe.
So the UAE slogan is: if they have to stop, they should stop with us. The Belgrade reality as a transfer point is however like the one of Vienna or Munich regarding the European flights: if passangers fly, they should make one more stop but enjoy better fares for instance. Hardly comparable business position!
Problem for Croatian Airlines its too small, management in charge of the airline was narrow minded in their expansion plans and indecisive.
DeleteCroatian Airlines flies to 28 destinations with a fleet of 12 aircraft, during summer season has more flights out of Dubrovnik and Split than out of Zagreb its main hub, and even than it can't keep up.
As a result, there's a summer and winter schedule, one in which airline has barely 250 weekly flights out of Zagreb in winters and less than 200 weekly operations out of Zagreb in summers.
Major issues with reliability and ability to maintain year round schedule even out of its main hub, all cause airline has too few aircraft to maintain 28 destinations and demand for 320 weekly flights out of Zagreb (currently 250).
It can't go on like that, Croatian Airlines needs a smart airline boss and marketing man who can transform airline in to a real national airline. Croatian Airlines is only airline in the region with a brand name, yet it has failed to cash in.
So the UAE slogan is: if they have to stop, they should stop with us. The Belgrade reality as a transfer point is however like the one of Vienna or Munich
Delete---
I wasn't trying to compare JUs potential business model to that of SQ or QR. It was a discussion regarding the name of the airline! OP was referring to the fact that "mini states" don't name their airlines after the country, but that they are rather trying to make them regionally acceptable by choosing a more "neutral" name. Mentioning Singapore and Qatar was just to prove the opposite, nothing else.
Like always in life and business everything depands on the contexts. Qatar and Sigapore are targeting weather national nor regional customers. They make profit with making a transit focus for passangers who are departuring 5000 km away from Qatar or Signapore and also head to deppart 5000km away from Qatar or Singapore. They are transporting passangers that have no clue or any connotations with Qatar or Singapore, and if we assume that Belgrade will be a hub for passangers from Nairobi to fly to Stockholm than it is totally indiferent if new company is called Air Serbia or Air Tasmania.
DeleteHowever, Belgrade can never gain the transit rolle Singapore or Dubai are having, although it would be a propper business decission for Etihad to make a Europe-Africa hub in Belgrade.
So what´s stays in Europe is one´s own market. And if it´s France or Germany or Italy we are talking about, than the national market is one´s own market that secures the business and make profit. Not because it is Germany, France or Italy, but because of 70-90 000 000 inhabitants and some 20 airports in each country. On the other hand, in strongly balkanized regions like our is, securing a fair market means by all means of logic to go reginally, not nationally, cause the whole region is having just as much customers as France, Germany or Italy.
Bull as usual, especially that "the whole region is having jus as much customers as France, Germany or Italy".
DeleteAt least we don´t have to fight about bare numbers. You obviously just wait to be offensive and rude.
DeleteNo need to get upset, I just strongly disagree with your views. Peace on Earth :)
DeleteNo, additionally to that you are being rood and offensive. Even there where numbers are clear. There is, however, no good behaviour on this forum. Starting with a jelous publishing of vintage pictures in mini format, up to stigmatizing of the readers who try to put other views on subject.
DeleteWhy should I be upset? Etihad and JAT will make they way of business this way or around. Afterall, that´s all what is about in free, market and resposibility oriented economy: to aknowladge particular visions, strategies, success and failiors of a very particular management, not a company as such. Appart from those guys (and women) doing a hard job, there are newspapers, forums, blogs, coffee shops, where people come around in order to discuss - with no inpact on company´s real strategy. Just bully around one or few commentators because they are having another oppinion or "strongly disagree" is unpolite. Especially if you doubt some basic remarks as such that our whole region is having a comparable customer number with French, Italian or German national market.
DeleteThe flights are not loaded yet in Amadeus. Just checked.
ReplyDeleteDoes anybody know registrations of those A319s?
ReplyDeletewe will se. i guess either AIx or AKx because there are the only ones missing in the sequence:
DeleteAHx - DC9s
AJx - DC9s
ALx - ATRs
AMx - DC10s
ANx - 737s
AOx - 737s
AKx were 727s...
DeleteMybe AAx, for Airbus
DeleteAIx- IL-18, DC-6
DeleteSo if we follow the logic , it would be YU-APA ,as YU-AOx is almost exhausted. Consider that YU-AOA was a A320 from Adria, there were Fokker 100 from MNX as well in AOx.
oh, i completly forgot about old planes :-) by logic, it would be either APx or AFx, but ABx would make sense (AB - Airbus)
Deletedali je poznato da se menjaju isto ATR ili ostaju trenutno i stari koje jat trenutno ima, u petak sam leteo sa YU-ALO do beca, onaj horor koji sam doziveo u avionu, a cesto letim i znam kad je koji zvuk normalan je bio strasan a da nepricam da smo se svi putnici skuvali posto ventilacija uopste nije radila!
ReplyDeletesvi turboprop su grozni avioni, i u svetu se koriste za destinicije do 400 km i poluaerdorome. A kod nas lete 1000 km i muce ljude.
Deleteyes the turboprop will get IFE as well :D
DeleteActually, Alenia offers IFE as an option with their newer models.
Deletenecu da kazem da su turboprop avionu losi, naprimer leteo sam i sa dash sa croatia i austrian, i sa atr jatovim, ali problem je sto je avion svaki 10 sekundi davao neki cudan zvuk u kabini, ventlicacija skoro pa nije radila, vrucina katastrofa, nekako bas kao horor trip!
Deletefor me dash is more better than atr!
DeleteDash-8 is a very comfortable and fast aircraft. I don't know why everyone is making a big fuss about it.
DeleteVery comfortable it is not (doesn't have window blinds for one), and neither is it fast (try flying ZAG-CPH for instance). However, it's bearable and the best there is in terms of turboprops.
Delete"Highlights in the 2013/14 winter schedule include double daily flights to Athens, Moscow, Paris, Podgorica, London, Vienna and Zurich"
ReplyDeleteLondon?
Which two daily flights?
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteMaybe they will launch a daily flight to Gatwick next summer? I guess another flight to Heathrow is out of the picture. It will be interesting to see what happens with the additional two evening LHR slots.
DeleteIt's one daily flight to LHR. Apologies for the typo.
DeleteI'm sure they will go double daily next summer. It is only a matter of flying both to LHR, or 1xLHR+1xLGW
DeleteI guess this timetable puts to rest any claims that Air Serbia will become a mere feeder to its masters, Air Berlin and Etihad. It's really nice to see Air Serbia fight back and reverse the trend we have been seeing since 2009, that is the competition taking over the market while Jat withdraws.
ReplyDeleteI have a feeling that Etihad will eventually remove all turboprop aircraft from Air Serbia's fleet. Sarajevo and Podgorica are best proof of it as they are two prime destinations which could/should be served by a turboprop. When it comes to Sarajevo, the sheer shortness of the flight will be very bad for the aircraft itself as it will speed up the metal fatigue. When it comes to Podgorica they will lose the competitive advantage when it comes to the efficiency of the aircraft.
But let's wait and see how well the Middle Eastern model plays out in the Balkans.
Great timetable, I can't wait to see the flight times and the prices. This is just the first step, by next summer things should be totally different.
they've stated that they are doing the opposite - buying more turboprops for next year.
Delete+ 1
Delete@Doot,
DeleteActually they never made a statement about it, that is Etihad. It was only Hogan that mentioned it once and that was months ago. The rest were all speculations coming from various sources.
They are completely silent when it comes to the future of turboprops. There were rumours that Air Serbia would be getting the Dash 8 aircraft but then shortly after this decision was reversed and so on.
That's why I am not too optimistic about the future of turboprops with Air Serbia.
After all, it's not like they face tough competition in the region so as to desperately need them.
You are right.
DeleteEtihad never made it clear about turboprops in Air Serbia's future fleet.
I think they will use it as a temporary solution for at least a year or so, and if they manage to squeeze or marginalize some competitors out of some of the regional routes (like TGD,TIV, SJJ) with lower fares with equal or better product, they might consider going with jets only.
However this is just a my wild guess and speculation, nothing more.
Well, we all guess and speculate here. :)
DeleteI am sure Etihad will try to have an all A320 series fleet due to fleet/family commonality. It will reduce maintenance expenses and facilitate timetable organization. But I guess time will tell if we were right or not.
The way to go I think, let's hope Etihad thinks the same way.
DeleteWhat surprises me are the people who constantly complain something about Air Serbia, which did not even start operating yet by the way... They keep forgeting how bad situation Jat was in, and that this Jat-Etihad deal even six or so months ago was considered impossible, jatovanje, and God knows what.
The point is that things change in a positive way in a year, not to mention 3 or 5 years.
I am very optimistic about the whole thing, and to those who have negative thoughts I have just one question: Was there any better alternative?
you said LHR is double daily, but in table is only one daily. which is correct?
ReplyDeleteProbably 1 LHR, 1 LGW
DeleteIt's one daily flight to LHR. Apologies for the typo.
DeleteI suspect alot of this flights will be canceled before they even take off due to lack of intrest!
ReplyDeleteShhhh, your not aloud to be critical!
DeleteThere will be no flights suspended, since Etihad is famous for its 2 years plan policy, which means that they are stucking to the flights and plan 2 years regardless of load factor. The idea is that each rout and line needs one or one and a half years to be path down before one can say if it´s profitable or not. If in two years the numbers show that this Gastarbeiter-timetable makes no profit, than I´m just afraid that Etihad will leave, without making attempt to try some other business model.
DeleteAnd you are Etihad's Deputy CEO and know all their plans, way of thinking, what's in their heads? Are you serious?
DeleteThey are about to formally take over managing the airline, yet you plan them to leave in two years? I really don't get it.
And what's with irrational term Gastarbeiter timetable?
Are Abu Dhabi, Prague, Bucharest and so on Gastarbeiter destinations as you call them?
Is the current Jat timetable a Gastarbeiter one? Because they are mostly boosting the frequencies of current one, apart from adding some new destinations gradually?
Which timetable would satisfy you? Five daily flights to Sarajevo, Skopje, Zagreb...? Or direct flights Dubrovnik-Copenhagen or Sarajevo-Frankfurt for example?
That's not gonna happen, because Etihad wants to make a profitable airline not a loss making former JAT Yugoslav Airlines.
1. I just said what´s the general policy in the airline.
Delete2. Etihad´s CEO has stated that they plan to stay for 5 years period in order to see if they can make profit. If not, they will be leaving. You are probably the only one who didn´t get that.
"If in two years the numbers show that this Gastarbeiter-timetable makes no profit, than I´m just afraid that Etihad will leave, without making attempt to try some other business model."
DeleteThat's what you said.
Yes, that they will live in 2018, as schedualed if the company makes no profit
DeleteWhat about the other questions asked?
DeleteYou only state your usual regional mantra :))
&&&&&&&&&&
And what's with irrational term Gastarbeiter timetable?
Are Abu Dhabi, Prague, Bucharest and so on Gastarbeiter destinations as you call them?
Is the current Jat timetable a Gastarbeiter one? Because they are mostly boosting the frequencies of current one, apart from adding some new destinations gradually?
Which timetable would satisfy you? Five daily flights to Sarajevo, Skopje, Zagreb...? Or direct flights Dubrovnik-Copenhagen or Sarajevo-Frankfurt for example?
That's not gonna happen, because Etihad wants to make a profitable airline not a loss making former JAT Yugoslav Airlines.
That's what I thought. No answers to the questions which can harm your wrong regional base theory?
DeleteFlights to Sarajevo, Skopje and Podgorica will all be upgraded from turboprop aircraft to the Airbus A319. As a result, one of the three daily flights to Podgorica (which operated last season) will be discontinued.
ReplyDelete__
As far as I know, there was always one Podgorica flight per day with B737. So the aircraft type change is no excuse or reason for canceling 7 flights per week. Those were traditional flights, people flying often from TGD to BEG knew that time table very well, and I believe JAT/Air Serbia is going to lose not just some passangers in Montenegro but also the image.
i tend to disagree. People flying frequently between BEG and TGD tend to choose Montenegro Airlines, exactly because the of the fact that YM has two flights from BEG, one at 8:50 and the other at 17:30/18:00 and those timings can be counted on, delays are rare.
DeleteJat had been cancelling the flights all the time and has proven unreliable on that route, things only slightly improved in the past few months. So there is no face to be lost there, it is long gone.
Besides, I am yet to see the full load on YM or JU to TGD. So far, the closest I saw was 80%.
+ 1
DeleteThe only logical explanation is that they will sign a code share agreement with YM and let them fit Belgrade with passangers.
Delete*feed belgrade
DeleteMeh!
ReplyDeletenot so much regarding the schedule (its a solid first step) , but the "exclusivity"
and yeah uh oh Austrian is so afraid that Jat will start Varna services , haha , sure
It is not only about Varna it is about the Balkans in general. Since Malev collapsed and since Niki considerably reduced its presence in the region they were left unopposed.
DeleteNow, first time in a long time, they are going to face real competition. Varna is just one of the routes where they will face problems.
OS is not afraid of JU in general (yet), but is and should be "afraid" for its Varna service. Actually, "afraid" is a bad word - they won't be able to charge premium for being the only carrier at that particular airport. That's it, the route will become significantly less profitable for them.
Delete+1
DeleteI need to add. OS is in deep trouble financially. LH will not be able to foot their bills forever, so at the moment, OS is in no position to simply dump the prices on these routes and try to chase competition away with rock bottom prices only.
DeletePlus, Vienna as a hub has one small problem at their hands, Munich as a hub very close by.
Fear - no, slight unease - perhaps.
Btw is Air Serbia going to end codeshare with OS, as there were some rumours? They might start codesharing with Niki, being a member of AB group?
DeleteVienna is a good example of what lack of competition does. Once Niki left prices went up from 87 eur for a RT to 140 with both JU and OS. Greedy bastards :)
You can still purchase a 90-100 euros ticket if you book on time. Nothing unsual about that. People shloud just stop expecting to get good prices if they call the booking centre as if they want to make a bus reservation a week or two in advance.
DeleteSemms to me, that we will have a small party in many airliners headquaters in the region and around the europe. I cannot believe that Etihad let him be deceived that Serbian emigrants should build up their focus group. No wonder that they have chosen the branding "Air Serbia". A pitty, however, that they have also chosen the destiny of all national airliners in the region that were, in the quite same way, conducted by national myths and emotions rather than serious strategies and facts. And downgrading TGD to two flights daily - it´s a pick of irrationality.
ReplyDeleteHow many comments exactly did you write today with all the same crap about some neutral name you propose?
DeleteYou can't even type correctly anymore with amount of spam you produce daily.
Name is chosen, get a life.
I just said that after seeing this emigrants oriented timetable, I´m starting to understand how did it come that the "Air Serbia" was chosen. Although it´s not your business, you are probably right about the time and that´s it is senseless. Making a calculations and business with Gastarbeiters, however, is like making the business with dead passangers and customers. It´s a concept that needs to fail - if not in 2013, than certainly in few years, and we will be let with that nationalistic name and no passangers.
DeleteWith all respects, I don´t believe that all of my posts are having the same content, although they are bringing up the same logic.
If British Airways and Air France have one true hub in their own respective countries then I do not see why Air Serbia should be bothered with opening bases around the ex-Yugoslav region when it can funnel all those passengers via its Belgrade hub. It just doesn't make sense. Opening more bases in a low-yielding market only increases the costs without any decent cash return.
ReplyDeleteA base doesn´t mean a hub. You don´t think seriously that Air France and Biritish Airways are having only one base. OMG. There are some cities, with some 500 000 inhabitants, like Skoplje and Sarajevo, that just cry out to be used as basis with serious profit.
DeleteWe could also add Lufthansa's failure to establish profitable bases with its own brand beyond Frankfurt and Munich.
DeleteTurkish Airlines is another airline that is massively concentrated on Istanbul, even its Anadolujet venture has failed.
Air France and British Airways are centred around Paris and London.
DeleteAir France tried your theory and it failed miserably so they went back to funneling all passengers via Paris with some minor operations out of Marseille and so on.
The model with numerous bases doesn't work in today's aviation business.
Also, stop using Wizz Air as an example. No one knows if they are profitable. They have yet to publish their financial performance.
Lufthansa's failure to establish profitable bases with its own brand beyond Frankfurt and Munich.
Delete___
Is this all a kind of joke? Frankfurt and Munich are hubs, but there are planty other German cities that are having direct connections out of those hubs. Berlin? Duesseldorf? Hamburg? Stuttgart? Cologne-Bonn? Hannover?
Do you might reading what I wrote before writing such replies? I wrote with its own brand.
DeleteAll routes operated out of German cities other than Munich and Frankfurt will be transferred to Germanwings.
Lufthansa is also slowly shutting down all long-haul flights from its 'countryside'. Best example being the Tokyo-Dusseldorf route which was suspended last year. At this point LH's longhaul network out of DUS has shrunk to only two routes.
Another example is Austrian Airlines. If your theory is so amazing why aren't they operating flights out of Salzburg, Graz, Linz...
You are mixing up a HUB, and a BASE. Those are two fully different things. That´s why the discussion with you is pointless. It´s all about using the open sky agreement. Nobody has ever dramed about JAT having 10 hubs, but one hub in Belgrade, with bases in the region is something that is not only a realistic scenario, but the only type of business that can make profit in a mini-coutnries region of Southeast Euorope. - An Airliner which in the manners of psychology and routs will not be "a Serbian" or "a Croatian", but Balcanese, Adriatic, Southeast Euorpean, Dinaric, or just simply a neutral Aeroput for different countries.
Deletehttp://airchive.com/galleries/lufthansaroutemapeurope1212_27442.jpg
Another example is Austrian Airlines. If your theory is so amazing why aren't they operating flights out of Salzburg, Graz, Linz...
Delete___
Vienna is practically a Lufthansa hub. Austrian is hit by the same critic as all little-nations airlines today. Archaic concept that can be saved only with some extravagant transfer-passanger policy. Which is a good policy but has nothing to do with that "Gastarbeiter-business" JAT and Etihad are offering for this winter.
You are losing the plot today, aren't you?
DeleteThe only business model that can be profitable is to have one hub, no bases and to offer connections from the region via the hub to the rest of the network.
DeleteYour problem is that you are offering theoretical possibilities while I am giving you concrete examples of how what you are proposing would NOT work.
After all, LOT had many bases around Poland and they were forced to close them becuse they were unprofitable. Now they have been all tranferred to EuroLOT which is a separate company.
Air Serbia not being a lowcost carrier makes opening new bases even harder. So no, in this particular case it would not work.
Strongly agree
DeleteIt is an abstract theory that makes no sensce in our Balkan case. In Poland or France people are having feeling that they belong to one country and one nation, and for them it might be normal to have Paris and Warsaw as a focus city and to fly via Warsaw or Paris to, lets say, Frankfurt. Now, we don´t have this feeling in our region. The region is segregated, with many countries, each of them having its focus cities, and each of them having a population that might even feel uncofortable with a thought to have Belgrade as a focus city.
DeleteAnd even than, people have to accept the company that is opperating transfers as their company, and will never happen with a brand "Air Serbia" and Sarajevo or Skoplje passangers - unlike with Air France in France or LOT in Poland. So, what I´m basicly saying, is that our region needed a company that will have branding that would allow all people off the region to identify that company as theri company. - If that company would only offer tranfers via Belgrade, or offer some direct connections or even open bases - that´s a question of individual economical decission. For instance, there are good reason for flying directly from Tivat or Duburovnik to Paris during the summer - something which can, however be done without opening a base. And if there are cities where economical decision allows more direct dialy flights, than it is justified to make base out of that city - which means to have a plane or two that are always operating from that city, and perhaps to have a domestic crew. For not offered direct flights, passangers could always be transfered to Belgrade.
Business is done with facts, not some abstract comparations with other companies that show now respect for social reality, people character, feelings.
There is this like a huge Polish or French market which inlcudes one nation, with a focus on only one city, which is fair enough. In our region, however no national market is big enough for a serious aviation business. And a regional company would have to concider that it serves as a domestic company in not only one country, within one nation and one focus city.
Yeah because an average passengers from Skopje or Sarajevo considered Jat as 'their' company? Give me a break. It was as Serbian as Air Serbia will be.
DeleteAnyone who flew with Jat and transferred in Belgrade until now will keep on doing so regardless of the name Air Serbia.
Good prices, convenient schedules and a good frequent flyer programme will lure passengers to fly with Air Serbia.
But hey, even if passengers from ex-Yugoslav region refuse to fly with Air Serbia that's not a big deal.
With daily flights to Tel Aviv, Bucharest, Istanbul... coming along I am sure the airline will not be heavily affected.
People are overestimating the importance of the ex-Yugoslav region. Air Serbia is expanding into new markets from where it will drain more passengers. The ex-Yugoslav region is just one small part of the greater puzzle.
No, JAT certainly not. But some other brand, with good media coverega could easily get that status. - But in order to make that effect its quite suitable to make a base in resceptfull city and have local cabin crew and pilots.
DeletePeople are overestimating the importance of the ex-Yugoslav region.
Delete___
Well, it seems difficult even to overestimate Croatia with its 12 000 000 tourists per year. Not to speak about the whole ex Yugoslavia or Souteast Europe.
+1
DeleteMost of the tourists that fly into Croatia arrive on charter flights. In other words they are irrelevant to this discussion. Air Serbia is not a charter carrier but a scheduled one so you have to compare apples to apples.
DeleteI really cannot opperate any economical discussion with a term and argumetn "that most are doing this or this". Aeroflot, Lufhtansa, Air France, SAS, Austrian, Air Berlin, LOT, CSA, Iberia, Al Italia - or this companies are takinf a part of the Croatian 12 000 000 foreign tourist per year cake. Some of them with ordinary flights, some of them doing charters like JAT has always done. Is there any clue that JAT will make no charter flights any more?
Delete+ There is a bunch of LCC flying to Croatian sea cost on a schedualed base.
Airport Dubrovnik top airlines - opperations 2012
Deletehttp://www.airport-dubrovnik.hr/images/stories/stat/tabl3.jpg
http://www.airport-dubrovnik.hr/images/stories/ljetni_red_letenja_2013.pdf
DeleteYes but what is the ratio of tourist passengers arriving on scheduled flights and those arriving on charter ones. That's the whole point.
DeleteAs most passengers fly on charter airlines it only means that there is no business for Air Serbia.
There is nothing wrong with charter business, it's just that it is not what airlines like Air Serbia are after.
My comment was posted before I saw your links. Yes, that is an impressive list but you have to understand that all those airlines are filling their seats thanks to travel agencies buying them for their package holidays.
DeleteThat's not only in Croatia, that's the norm for all holidays destinations.
I am sure that OU's flights from the coast to other European destinations are mostly filled the same way.
http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/croatia-airlines-could-its-network-attract-a-bidder-125405
Delete"Domestic monopoly, but only 20% of the international market"
Another proof how pointless and unprofitable would be for Air Serbia to enter such a competitive yet low yield market there, before sorting the things out in Belgrade.
If OU as a national carrier cannot make more then 20% market share, why would JU bother thinking about it which it does not by the way. This is one of the reasons why opening of regional bases that guy promotes is a wrong move. Luckily, Etihad is aware of it.
OU does not have ragional bases in Split or Dubrovnik. They just keep their planes circle from Zagreb. The reason why OU is having just a 20% of the market is that they have tried for years to avoid direct flights from other destinations than Zagreb. Introducing a lot of direct lines from Dubrovnik, Zagreb or Zadar is a part of recent policy.
Delete...Do you know the % JU is having in Belgrade? 20% in summer resorts is quite a good %, regarding all the charters.
DeleteYou mean the percentage of Jat's passengers at Belgrade airport? It's roughly 40%,
DeleteWhat happened with Amsterdam going double daily?
ReplyDeleteObviously not during winter season, maybe next summer.
ReplyDeleteGood day to all of you. I have to share with all of you here the sheer joy that its Sunday and a day off from work from me :)
ReplyDeleteReading to all the comments... Guys, a year ago, even the 3pw Tel Aviv flight with no stops in Larnaca would be considered as news... Now there will be 7 of them and no stops in Larnaca and people are still complaning. If you look into the JAT timetables in the past few years the changes are HUGE.
Same with flight numbers. Aeroflot and Lufthansa had only one system-wide flight number change in the past decade and we have it here as well. This is a big deal for every airline.
I am thrilled that we shall have a proper airline in Belgrade with a decent FF program. I keep collecting my miles in 4 different frequent flier programs (JU, YM, Miles&More (JP&LH) and Flying Blue (AF&AZ) and I never manage to get any decent rewars as my miles are spread across the field...
I see people (or one person - jury is still out) repeating the same statements regarding „Regional Brand“ vs. „Air Serbia“ for days. Guys, just let it go! If for noone else, for the sake of us who are actually reading your words every single time. Air Serbia brand is to stay with a hub&spoke business model, for the time being at least... multiple operational bases are not in the cards and will not be, in the forseable future. So let it go... or sign in with the proper name so that we know who is saying what.
Turboprops are to stay, they will focus on newer ones, with comfort levels close to those of the jet aircraft. We heard that on these small regional routes, ATRs are the best option.
@ EXYU – Thank you for the coverage of all things airborne in the Balkans. Following the blog is true fun. It is the source of all aviation news from other countries as well. I could only wish for if we could all use usernames or niknames so that we can distinguish eachother between numerous Anonymous, like we have at Airliners.net
Sorry, but I just cann´t be so enthustistic wiht a business model that counts on dead passangers. We shall look and see, I hope all the best for Serbian carrier, would be proud to see it as a succesfull company. But still, I feel deeply disappointed that Etihad took over a sensless and losing "nashi-ljudi"-strategy from JAT. It reminds me on 80s, maybe somehow on Tereza Kesovija living out in Paris and standing on the front page of JAT`Review as a "model-immigrant". Nothing to do with gerontological assimilation reality of our out of Serbia communities.
DeleteI really hope that we can see some more stress in Africa and Middle East transfer passangers in the future.
To many chances that have been just let to pass away beacuse of unrealistic-nationalstic ideas on business.
I see people (or one person - jury is still out) repeating the same statements regarding „Regional Brand“ vs. „Air Serbia“ for days. Guys, just let it go!
Delete-----------------
It is just one person, i.e. Anonymous at 1:08 PM, who cannot hold his frustration with Air Serbia name, and keeps nagging about some regional neutral name.
While his opinion is appreciated, it is getting boring a bit with that many comments over and over.
Enjoy your Sunday, guys.
well, perhaps you should concentrate on only 1 FF program instead of 4 if you'd like to get a decent reward :)
DeleteI tried, but it just doest work, flight times are my priority, not chasing FF miles.
DeleteThank you for all the hard work ex-yu. While some don’t appreciate it I think they are a minority. Keep up the good work and don’t get discouraged by a few nasty envious comments.
ReplyDelete+1
Delete+1
DeleteWhat will happen with livery and product on B737 after Oct 27?
ReplyDeleteIn Poland or France people are having feeling that they belong to one country and one nation, and for them it might be normal to have Paris and Warsaw as a focus city and to fly via Warsaw or Paris
ReplyDelete---
I also don't consider MUC, FRA, VIE, SVO, DOH, LHR to be part of my nation, but... you see where this is going. And if their offers were better, I would have also included WAV and CDG to the list, or any other airport for that matter.
Not getting the point.
DeleteAbout fricken time Serbia stepped out of the shadow of former Yugoslavia to promote herself. Air Serbia is a great start.
DeleteEx-YU what was the comment record on your blog? At the rate at which we are moving I wouldn't be surprised if we broke it today.
ReplyDelete158 is the record :)
DeleteThanks!
DeleteI feel like we are gonna break that record today :)
DeleteNo Gotheburg this winter?
ReplyDeleteGothenburg was only operated for 2 weeks last winter around New Year.
Delete29 destinations with 243 weekly departures during winter season.
ReplyDeleteWell done Air Serbia!
Wish you many more new routes during next summer 2014.
Hello Anonymous at September 1, 2013 at 10:45 AM
ReplyDeleteYou've said,
"svi turboprop su grozni avioni, i u svetu se koriste za destinicije do 400 km i poluaerdorome. A kod nas lete 1000 km i muce ljude."
Please let me know what could be "poluaerodromi". Thanks
Užice, Morava...
DeleteI like that almost every destination at least one daily... And Abu Dhabi will eventually become daily I think when more A319s come.
ReplyDeleteEx-Yu - It is not photo credi but CREDIT of Igor Salinger. Secondly, why do you keep ignoring user's request of sorting out the destinations list by alphabetical order, if you could announce them today all in alphabetical order, what's the stubbornness?
ReplyDeleteMe too.
ReplyDeleteEtihad said that AUH will be a daily once more A319s arrive.
And so glad that PRG is back :)
Would be disappointed if however they don't introduce BCN 4xpw from next summer, at least as a seasonal. I cannot figure out what happened since JK went bust, no one re-introduced it, was hoping for VY by now...
The timetable is very very ambitious!
ReplyDeleteAir Serbia really does not shy away from their competitors
which you can see on their Istanbul and Copenhague flights.
Imagine the massive competition they have with TK almost flying thrice a day and Pegasus.
And then Wizzair from Malmo,which is next to Copenhague.
Nearly all flights are daily,which is a condition for business travellers
to consider booking with them.
Now we are missing only LED,BCN and Hamburg in the network.
Thats for the summer season,when also frequency have to increase.
Especially double dailies to AMS and LHR.
I would actually also add that there is Munich missing from their network but then again it is not easy to compete with three daily flights operated by Lufthansa.
DeleteInterestingly enough, Turkish Airlines has not yet loaded their additional flights to Belgrade. It makes me wonder if they will add them in the end.
The competition is strong, but with a competitive price and a strong product, I think they'll do great. If they can price match TK, surely more Serbians will use JU.
DeleteTurkish Airlines is not so great once you get a chance to fly on them. From afar they seem great and professional but then when you take a closer look you start to see the flaws. Things you would never see with airlines such as Jat or Croatia Airlines.
DeleteHere is a description of a Turkish Airlines A330-300 flight from Istanbul to New York. I copied it from Airliners.net
-----------------------
'TC-JNM "Samsun" had a full load today. It was a lot of firsts for me on this flight.
-I have never seen specialty meals delivered through the same door the pax were boarding, very unprofessional.
-FA asking the gate agents to check some luggage (gate check), they had no idea how to deal with it.
-I have never seen giant garbage bags piled up at the doors during the flight, no place to store it???
-I have never seen this many infants on a flight, never seen people changing diapers in the cabin???
-Never seen one of the chefs coming off from his rest in a t-shirt, carrying his uniform in his hand???
-An FA eating a piece of cheese with her hands 15 minutes before touch down and complaining that she is starving
Alll and all it was chaotic, the whole flight, constant shuttling of food, trays, bags, drinks back and forth...Slow, unattractive service. The whole plane looked like a war zone when we landed. '
----------------------------------
I guess this is normal when you expand as fast as Turkish Airlines has been expanding in recent times.
I can just agree. Turkish seems to have done a really grate deal on European routs, where they have introduces some full meals and really confortable cabins. But long-haul flights with Turkish are find behind the standards even European airliners are offering. Not to speak about Far and Middle Eastern giants and their service.
DeleteAlso Turkish hub Ataturk airport in Istanbul is just awfull. It looks cheap and unprofessional in the same way as Belgrade airport looks - although it´s quit bigger, ofcourse.
I also heard people complain that the cabin temperature is way too high on most flights. Some say that it's because the crew want the passengers to be sleepy.
DeleteLOL... Sleepy passengers...couldn't stop laughing :))
DeleteDon't be so full of yourself and this crappy Air Serbia. Turkish Airlines is the best, I use them all the time. That's a REAL airline.
DeleteWhy is it crappy? Didn't even start flying yet and we don't know yet what they will offer product and price wise.
DeleteYour comment says a lot about you.
And the fact that you use TK all the time is not important to anyone but you.
@Ex-YU
ReplyDeletePlease, please, please, provide us with the flight number changes:) Pleeease :)
Does anyone have info regarding air bilaterals Serbia has with Russia? What is permitted and what is not?
ReplyDeleteApart from St. Petersburg, I always thought regular flights to Sochi should work and perhaps, routes to some of the secondary (yet rather large) cities like Nizhny Novgorod, Yekaterinburg, Samara,...
Will JU continue to operate closely with Aeroflot?
I believe that liberalization between Serbia and Russia is in the works now. If I am not mistaken the deal is supposed to be signed, or it was signed but not ratified... something like that.
DeleteIt is signed and ratified, and if I remember correctly new agreement allows both national carriers to operate flights to/from Moscow/Belgrade + one more destination of choice in Russia/Serbia.
DeleteBut I will check it on Parliaments site under passed laws section:)
But I thought they were supposed to sign an open skies agreement, or am I tripping?
DeleteI would have preferred double daily to Amsterdam before Athens.
ReplyDeleteI thought Amsterdam is one of their most successful routes?
Especially because they codeshare with KLM.
Flight to Amsterdam caters to the large number of connecting passengers but its frequency has always been around one daily or less, during winter.
DeleteIf the cooperation with AirBerlin intensifies, and in all likeliness - it will, there will be no sharp increase in passengers to Amsterdam, hence ho immediate need for two dailies.
Athens, on the other hand remained seriously underserved from Belgrade. A3 and OA are hoping to merge and none is doing much in the Balkans... so the chance is there to be snached, if possible.
My 2 eurocents
Well I wouldn't say that the two Greek airlines aren't doing much in the Balkans. Olympic Air, in addition to its vast domestic network, flies to Tirana, Sofia, Istanbul, Belgrade and Bucharest in the Balkans. But like you said,the two carriers are trying to merge so God knows what will become with Olympic's presence in Belgrade.
DeleteHowever, when Malev went belly up and when CSA axed Athens, Aegean immediately launched both Prague and Budapest. In case the two airlines don't merge then I doubt Olympic could stand on its own. If it goes bankrupt it will be interesting to see if Aegean would launch its own flights to Belgrade. My personal opinion is that they would not, especially if Air Serbia operates their own double daily flights.
Before the crisis Jat used to have three to four weekly flights to Athens- all operated with Boeing aircraft. In addition to that, Olympic Airways (up until 2009) operated up to 10 weekly flights. It was only for a short period that Aegean flew to Belgrade but their best month saw a loadfactor of only 52%. For Jat and Olympic Airways this route was high yielding because there were a lot of Greek businessmen flying to Belgrade. Unfortunately this is not the case now.
As it was mentioned by Contrails, with Air Serbia's partnership with Air Berlin there is no need to direct passengers towards Amsterdam. Especially not since Air Serbia will have its own codes towards north America. Regardless of this partnership there is enough O&D demand between Belgrade and the Netherlands to warrant a daily flight.
For me the most interesting thing will be to see how their Brussels route performs. Increasing it from 2 to 7 weekly flights is quite a lot of additional capacity. Though many have said on here that Air Serbia and Wizz Air will not compete directly with each other, I think this is one of few markets where they will. The other potentially being Paris.
I would add Copenhagen and Malmo as well.
DeleteDoes anybody knows with what kind of engines the aircrafts gonna be equipped? The dummy aircraft is with V2500 but the JAT Tehnika guys are doing the course on both engines. Whats happening with the B737?
ReplyDeleteBest wishes from Basel
Both Etihad airframes (A6-EIE & A6-EID) which are suppose to go to AirSerbia are equipped with 2x IAE V2524-A5.
ReplyDeleteOho, you know something more? :)
DeleteAre you sure? Those planes are 10 years old :/
DeleteNo, those are not going to Air Serbia. Air Serbia will receive Air Berlin's A319s which will be in excess due to their cost cutting measures.
DeleteNo, I am just a careful reader. They clearly stated that first two A319s are coming from Etihad (with crews) and that the down payment for the first five frames was made to CIT. Both Etihad A319 are CIT owned.
DeleteAir Berlin frames are not spring chicken eather, all four currently in the fleet are delivered in 2007-2009. Perhaps they will be disposing those NIKI is due to return to AirBerlin at the end of summer season. We shall see.
I would like to avoid people jumping in and start shouting "old planes" and similar nonsence, if possible. It is not something we should go into at the moment.
I think most of A319's will be coming from Air Berlin/Niki, but we will see anyway ;)
DeleteCan't wait to see Air Serbia's plane interiors tho...
@EX-YU: Why the A320-picture? A319-version would be more appropriate :)
ReplyDeleteI guess we broke the comment record today. This is the 159th comment. :)
ReplyDeleteCongrats Ex-YU.
+1 hear, hear :)
DeleteGuys, have you noticed that there was no fighting today, none whatsoever... Hurray for all of us :)
Wishing you all a successful start of yet another exciting week :)
Thanks both Nemjee and Contrails. It was nice to have a day where I didn't have to delete a single comment :)
DeleteActually, this post fits better here cause you did delete a comment today:
DeleteAnonymousSeptember 1, 2013 at 11:34 PM
Ex-Yu - Thank you for being hypocrite enough to acknowledge my comment and the mistake you've made about Salinger/credit but still refusing to change the list order according to some sane logic (alphabetical or flight numbers for flights starting on the same date) for some occult reason.
Could we have an explanation on that or will you delete this comment as well? What becomes of a Blog that takes a revolt from such suggestions?
Is there any chance that Etihad will buy stakes in B&H airline? and if yes o can see posible merger between Ju and JA with more regional name
ReplyDeleteWhy would Air Serbia change its name for a dysfunctional carrier with a fleet of two turboprop aircraft? Air Serbia/Etihad would be doing them a favour if they were to take them over and completely absorb them.
DeleteSo no, I think there is zero chance of it happening.
Personally I don't think so.
DeleteWhy would they spend additional money on JA when they can transfer majority of those pax via BEG, with good prices and connecting times.
I would be very glad to see that scenario happening. Perhaps also with YM and MAT. Somehow there is a critical geophraphical circle that is to be made if ones flies from Sarajevo or even Banja Luka to Paris over Belgrade. Zagreb and Ljubljana are far more suitable as connecting airports. Therefor, the only longtermed chance for Air Serbia is, as far as I believe, to offer direct flights from Sarajevo and perhaps Banja Luka, or even to make a Banja Luka an inportant airport that will take Sarajevo passangers to Western and Norhtern Europe as well.
DeleteMAT doesn't exist for ages
DeleteMAT has ceased the operations, but did it really sto to exist?
DeleteNo, they are still alive... in our hearts.
Deletelol
Ex-Yu - Thank you for being hypocrite enough to acknowledge my comment and the mistake you've made about Salinger/credit but still refusing to change the list order according to some sane logic (alphabetical or flight numbers for flights starting on the same date) for some occult reason.
ReplyDeleteCould we have an explanation on that or will you delete this comment as well? What becomes of a Blog that takes a revolt from such suggestions?
None of your comments have ever been deleted so I do not understand why you are constantly persisting with "or will you delete this comments as well". Thank you for pointing out the missing letter with the word "credit" which I added. As for the destination list I do not understand why the order is so important but since you insist I have changed it according the alphabetical order.
DeleteI just noticed that your original comment was actually missing here but it wasn't deleted. It was sent automatically to spam by the Blogspot platform which can only mean that one of your comments in the past has been marked as spam. I have retrieved the comment. I don't visit the comment section to read the comments, I get them via e-mail so I did not see that your comment was automatically sent to spam until i just checked.
DeleteAnd just for future reference. If you see that your comment has not been immediately published when you click the publish button it means it has automatically been sent to the spam filter. It doesn't necessarily mean that you have sent spam comments in the past, it can mean that you might have responded to someone's comment which has been marked as spam (I usually mark insult based comments as spam so the offenders don't get to keep publishing nationalistic vile). If you notice that this has happened and your comments are completely in-line with the commenting rules than just write another one that you can't see your comment and that way you will let me know that there has been a mix up and I can just unmark it from the spam filter. I would never and have never deleted comments which are critical towards the blog or the work I do.
DeleteThank you.
DeleteDoes anyone know what will be the policy of Air Serbia towards charter flights in summer 2014? Jat Airways is very busy with agency flights to Turkey, Greece, Egypt and so on.
ReplyDeleteIt would be interesting to know if Air Serbia will continue on this path?
Not at all, but let's guess at some of the options.
ReplyDeleteAs Government is the owner of both Jat's B733's and Aviogenex, they might transfer a few of them to AGX and they can offer majority of charters Jat used to.
Just a thought, we'll see anyway.
Chartrrs are usually easy cash for airlines, and maybe Etihad doesn't want to give them away, who knows?
There was some chatter a fee months ago about the goverment possibly transfering the entire Boeing fleet to AGX and making them a low cost company.
DeleteThe idea of transfering Jat' Boing fleet to Aviogenex for charters is a good one, however making it a LCC is a nonsense with planes that old. We will see...
Deletewow, 200 comments. must be a record
ReplyDeletecongrats dude :-)
ReplyDelete