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| Serbian Prime Minister announces five weekly Belgrade - New York flights for 2016 |
The Serbian Prime Minister, Aleksandar Vučić, announced yesterday that the country's national carrier, Air Serbia, will launch flights from Belgrade to New York next year which will operate five times per week. The comments were made following a meeting of the airline's Supervisory Board, the PM said. In a statement to the "B92" network, Mr Vučić noted, "It is very important that we held a meeting of the Air Serbia Supervisory Board, and that, in addition to the excellent results which have made it the leading carrier in the region, we concluded that we will fly to New York five times per week next year". He added, "Even from Athens there are no flights to New York despite the city being double the size of Belgrade. From Belgrade there will be flights to New York, not to mention that we already have on board Wi-Fi and other services which set our airline apart from other carriers in the region". Athens is in fact served seasonally from New York by Delta Air Lines.
Air Serbia itself has not committed to any dates or frequencies to the United States. However, in February, the airline's CEO, Dane Kondić, told "The Australian" daily that he hoped to realise transatlantic flights within the next twelve to fourteen months, but noted, "In terms of Belgrade and Serbia re-emerging in the world, it’s a natural ambition for the country to want to reconnect to many of the markets and places that they used to fly but Air Serbia has no aspirations to fly all over the world the way Jat Airways used to". Later on, in May, the airline said it was studying potential flights to the US but that no decision has been made.
In August, Air Serbia applied for a permit from the United States Department of Transportation (DoT), stating, "While Air Serbia initially proposes to provide scheduled air service from Belgrade to New York, Chicago and Miami pursuant to a codeshare arrangement with Air Berlin, Serbia's recent achievement of Category 1 status under the FAA's International Air Safety Assessment Program makes it possible for Air Serbia eventually to provide its own service to the United States”. Caitlin Harvey, from the DoT, recently told EX-YU Aviation News that Air Serbia's application is "under active Department consideration", adding that the processing time for applications varies from case to case. According to the Serbian government, an Airbus A330-200 will be leased for the flights, at a cost of 500.000 USD per month. Last September, the President and CEO of Etihad Airways and Vice Chairman of Air Serbia, James Hogan, said the jet could be transferred to the Serbian airline from the Etihad Airways group.
Vucic is a moron. Why announce your plans so much in advance giving your competition time to prepare. On top of it all, I highly doubt many airlines are making any money in NYC, it's mostly about prestige.
ReplyDeleteAt this point it has become more than obvious that these NY flights are nothing more and nothing less than a political move. Hogan is not stupid and he knows that JU is not ready. I mean, how many airlines with 10 Airbuses and 5 Atrs do you know that have transatlantic flights?!
Hehe kakve veze ima velicina bazne folote sa otvaranjem interkontinentalnih letova pametnjakovicu?!
DeleteExactly!
DeleteI see Mr Vucic as a megalomaniac. He's just proved that with his "Belgrade at Water" deal.
HAHAHAHA pa ako nemas ogroman O&D potencijal (sto ovde realno nema) onda ti treba solidna flota kako bi mogao da siris mrezu i tako nudis presedanja. U ovom trenutku JU nema ni jedno ni drugo sto cini ove letove katastrofom u najavi. Mene samo zanima koga planiraju da voze sa trenutnim redom letenja.
DeleteLokalci ce im popuniti mozda 20% kabine.
Air Seychelles with half the fleet size of JU and 10% the number of passengers that JU carries, has an A330 that flies to Paris - which is further than BEG-JFK and will soon also be flying to China.
DeleteSo what's your point ?
OMG Seychelles were a French colony, they speak French there so it's only natural for them to have direct flights to Paris. How on earth would they reach Paris with a narrowbody aircraft?! As for Beijing, that's in order to attract tourists so it's different. It's like one of those flights from Manchester to Heraklion operated by Thomas Cook's A333.
DeleteThat's my point.
@9:15 taj red letenja im je doneo rast od 68% u prosloj godini a solidno rastu i u ovoj godini. No iż tvog glasnog smeha se vidi da si navijac pa ne bih dalje..
Deleteglupane, to su O&D pax, ili lete Francuzi dalje za Indiju? :D
DeleteMerde, ce fait mal
Anon 09.30
DeleteJeste i taj red letenja sto im je doneo rast od 68% nece vise postojati za koju nedelju imajuci u vidu da se broj frekvencija i destinacija znatno smanjuje.
Uz sve to, ako je broj putnika tako naglo porastao a kompanija je dodala svega dve dodatne ucestalosti (TIA i BEY) dok je drasticno smanjila celu svoju mrezu dokazuje da je yield bio katastrofalan. Tako da na kraju, da sam na vasem mestu ne bih se bas kitio tom cinjenicom o naglom rastu putnika.
@9:30 zasto bi se ja "kitio" tudjim perijem, bog sa tobom?! Da, posle prve godine ekpanzivnog reda letenja ASL koriguje manje profitabilne linije, sta je tu sporno? To je dokaz da neko domacinski i racionalno razmislja. Neke linije se ukidju zbog izrazito sezonskog karaktera.
DeleteHehe neke linije? Bolje reci skoro sve izuzev TIA i BEY.
DeleteA cisto sumnjam da je BUD ista sezonalniji od SOF ili OTP. Isto tako, cak i jake gasterbajterske linije se smanjuju na 4 leta nedeljno sto znaci samoubistvo za tranzitne putnike posto je connectivity trenutno osakacen. Idi ga prostudiraj pa dodji da pricamo.
Ali dobro, meni je i dalje najveci hit novi red letenja za SVO.
Pusti bre nedokazanog retardinja. Ostaje slican broj putnika sada imaju slobodnih aviona da probaju jos neku od linija koju ovde mesecima traze neki ljudi. Od Ankare, Kaira preko Teherana i jos neka u Jevropi.
DeleteVezati po jedan let za Bukurest, Sofiju, Atinu, Budimpestu, Zagreb i Tiranu na let za JFK makar LH davala karte za $500.
Teheran? Mozda se prvo obrazuj pa ces znati zasto je ova linija nemoguca u ovom trenutku.
DeleteDrugo, da te obrazujem. Red letenja se nece siriti ove zime jer je on napravljen tako da lete samo erbasevi i 4-5 Atra. U teoriji to je i dobro jer su matoriji atrovi nepouzdani i cesto se kvare. Problem je u tome sto ni jedan erbas nije stigao od proslog septembra. Sa ovim redom letenja JU nece postici bog zna sta.
A to kada kazes da se veze po jedan let za JFK, iskreno se nadam da ne mislis na jedan let nedeljno... Mene samo zanima kako ce izorganizovati letove tako da se nude presedanja u oba smera, to jest ako uopste bude letova.
Ali meni je hit kada narod kaze da ce se ovako povecati LF. Aha... samo me zanima sa kim posto nece biti nesto konkurentni na trzistu transfernih putnika.
Delete@10:21 meni ste "hit" vi hejteri, koji ste popili gorku pilulu toliko puta za ove dve godine da vam jos nije dobro.
DeleteAir Seychelles should by all means NOT be compared with Air Serbia. Their primary purpose is to fly tourists to SEZ and this is why they fly to CDG, HKG, JNB and BOM. Nothing to do with the colonialism (by the way they still use the British administration system over there as the British took them over from the French and ruled all until the independence).
DeleteMain connection hubs for the residents of Seychelles are AUH or DXB. The islands are so remotely located that even not-so-tourist routes such as TNR or DAR are covered with A332. Air Seychelles do not have ANYTHING smaller than A332 except for several DHC-6 that are only used for traffic between the islands.
And they are on good path as they doubled the number of A332 in the fleet from 2 to 4 - all leased from EY. And they now fly to much more destinations - only 2 years ago they had nothing but AUH and HKG covered with two birds. Etihad has done a lot to develop them although some "experts" predicted that they would never provide more planes and routes than what would be necessary to simply funnel all visitors through AUH.
Ne ulazeći u opravdanost linije, ne kapiram zašto je sada najava problem? Mesecima slušamo priče kako je kasno da se linija najavi tri ili četiri meseca unapred, jer mora da krene prodaja karata, da se poveća awareness itd. I sada kada se linija najavi više od četiri meseca unapred, oni su moroni, jer daju vremena konkurenciji da se pripremi.
DeleteDajte, više. Uostalom, nema šta LH da se "priprema" na konkurenciju od strane ASL. To je smešno. Podesiće cene kada ovi izađu sa svojima i to je sve.
Inače je poznato da kompanije koje se bave transatlantic saobraćajem po ceo dan ne rade ništa drugo nego što nervozno osluškuju oko sebe ko je sledeći najavio letove pa onda kreću u sveobuhvatne pripreme i kontramere...
DeleteHejteri su skroz prsli u zadnjih par meseci, prosto da čoveku bude žao.
LH vec sada ima cene koje ASL nikada ne moze da ima. LH u Frankfurtu puni flotu A380 aviona. To o reakciji LH samo lupetaju ovdasnji "strucnjaci" koji ne lete i koji ne razumeju kako funkcionisu cene u medjunarodnom avionskom saobracaju. ASL ce uvek imati jace cene od LH. Njega ce koristiti ljudi kojima ce preko Frankfurta biti drugo presedanje, a preko ASL prvo npr.
DeleteKompanije koje imaju slicne flote kao ASL
DeleteWK duplo manja Flota od ASL ali ipak imaju 2 A330
8U
SB
8H kako nase drage komsije uspevaju a da mora neka teorija zavere i fondova da postoji
XLF samo 2 738 i 4 330
7W Kako ovi prijatelji funkcionisu i ko su duplo manji od ASL i imaju 1 A332 ja stvarno ne znam .
INN-NS
WK - Edelweiss // you fool, this is a charter airline which means that they need the extra capacity for popular destination, both near and far from Switzerland. Also, are you comparing JU with them? A legacy carrier and a charter one.
Delete8U - Afriqiyah // it was something of a project by the Libyan government and at one stage they wanted to built something of Emirates in Tripoli, that is to link Africa with the rest of the world. So since they were a government project of an oil rich country, adequate fleet planning was not their priority. Once again you have selected an airline that is not in the same group as JU.
SB- Air Calin / do you understand where this airline is based? Do you realise how remote their base is? Do you know that they are mostly there to bring in tourists from places like South Korea, Japan... meaning that they need those planes? This airline is more similar to Edelweiss and Thomas Cook rather than Air Serbia.
8H - are you serious about this one?
Once you have proven how stupid you are.
Postovoje i kompanije koje nemaju uskotrupne avione, ali sve te kompanije su neuporedive sa ASL iz more razloga, a najveci je cini mi se zemlja u kojoj zivimo. Veliki broj ljudi i dalje npr za CPH; ARN; LHR... Putuje preko FRA, MUC, VIE sa LH grupom, jer je jednostavno vole.
DeleteSkoro sam leteo sa LH sa JFK preko FRA, dok sam cekao na FRA cuo sam komentare putnika, da nikada ne lete sa ASL, zbog politike oko izgubljenog prtljaga, zbog kasnjenja. Takav renome je jako tesko ispraviti za kratko vreme.
Ajde nemoj bit toliki trotl molim te:
DeleteWK je charter kompanija sa pokojom (vrlo rijetkom) redovnom linijom
8U je bio produkt bolesnih ambicija u prvom redu Libijske klike, a potom nisu pojma imali što bi sa time, pa su sada širokotrupci prizemljeni i konzervirani. Baš ti je super primjer! Nadam se da ne želiš da Air Serbija tako završi.
SB je kompanija Nove Kaledonije koja je usred ničega ni naravno da ima dva uskotripca za spajanje otoka, i šorokotrupce kojma uspjeva doći do nekog kopna. Takvih kompanija sa tek 3-4 aviona od čega 1-2 širokotrupca imaš mali milijun. I što to dokazuje. Pa njima je to jedini način preživljavanja.
8H je isključivo charter kompanija. Čak štoviše svoj širokotrupac iznajmljuju drugima jer realno nemaju pojam što bi sa njim. Nije li dovoljno reči da su bili u dealu sa ovim SkyGreece lumenima.
Isto tako je SE (XLF) charteraš. Znaš li ti uopče razliku i čemu njima služe šriokotrupci????
I 7W je charteraš sa samo jednim šorkotrupcem.
Dakle ovo je daleko najblesavije što si napisao do sada! Ovo upravo dokazuje KAKO NEMAŠ NI NAJMANJEG POJMA o avioprometu!!!!
Nema veze cime se bave bitno da postoijoje zaboravio sam i dodati UU.
DeleteI ja opet nisam kriv sto se vasi pakosni planovi nece ostvariti samo cete moci uzivati u prizoru ASL A 332
tako da tisina misevi .
INN-NA
When is Croatia Airlines launching its USA flights ?
DeleteKlinac, evo pravoz razloga zasto tebe niko ne shvata ozbiljno. Mesas babe i zabe i onda kada ti neko pokaze koliko lupas ti krenes da dajes neke trivijalne odgovore i da se vadis.
DeleteAko hoces da poredis JU sa drugim kompanijama onda to moras da radis sa onima sa kojima su u istoj grupi. U suprotnom narod ce se i dalje sprdati sa tobom... kao sto to radi od prvog dana kada si poceo da piss ovde.
Ja sam to video od vas ja ne uporedjujem kompanije kao prvo to niste ni vi ali vama manjka na intelegenciji pa zato ne primecujete da uporedjujem kao i vi flote :
DeleteINN-NS
Pretpostavljam da ti imas suvise inteligencije pa ti pravopis nije vazan, jel da?
DeleteIsto tako, ja se ne secam da si ti jednom koristio neku vrstu argumenta kada si branio ono sto si napisao... ili pre lupetao.
Mi ne uporedjujemo samo flote vec aviokompanije u celosti sto ukljucuje i to gde su bazirane, u kakvom okruzenju posluju... ti nista od toga ne spominjes.
Kao po obicaju vi skacete sa jednog na drugo prvo ste uporedjivali flote onda je skoro ne moguce uporedjivati.
DeleteINN-NS
Mi smo uporedjivali flotu JU sa kompanijama koje su u istoj kategoriji. Ti si taj koji krenuo da lupa i da uporedjuje sa carter kompanijama koje nemaju nikakve, ama nikakve, veze sa JU.
DeletePa ne mozete JU uporedjivati sa AF-KLM posto saraduju ili sa LH-LX BA koji su 10 puta veci i zive u ekonomsko bolje razvijenim zemljama a sve te kompanije sto sam ja naveo su iz slicnog podrucija i ekonomskog standarda kao srbija.
DeleteINN-NS
Pa da, posebno Edelweiss i XL France. lolz
DeleteSlusaj Marko, a zasto ne bi mogli da poredimo Er Srbiju sa kompanijama kao sto su Aegean, airBaltic, UIA, CSA...?
DeleteNe moze se porediti kao prvo to su neka vrsta hibridnih LCC kao drugo ekonomski se ne moze porediti.
DeleteINN-NS
Od kada su CSA, Aegean i UIA hibridne kompanije? Isto, zasto se Srbija ne moze porediti sa na primer Ceskom ili Letonijom? Sa kime bi je ti poredio? Sa Novom Kaledonijom ili Libijom? lol
DeleteZato sto je ekonomija i standard veci u ostalom Csa ima isto samo jedan 333
DeleteINN-NS
Hmm i dalje mi nisi rekao sa kime onda mozemo porediti Srbiju pametnjakovicu.
DeleteDa, i koriste ga na liniji za ICN gde isto tako leti KE tako da to nije problem. Plus, postoji mogucnost da im dostave jos jedan A333. Na kraju krajeva ta linija za Seul je tu zato sto KE nije mogao da dodje do jos letova za PRG.
Moze se porediti za Ex Yu i RO i BG a sa ostalim zemljama teze.
DeleteINN-NS
RO? Da li shvatas koja je razlika u GDP-u izmedju Srbije i Rumunije?
DeleteRumunski GDP je cak veci od madjarskog ali po tebi Srbiju ne mozes porediti sa HU.
Dobro izvinite stuo sam zaboravio HU
DeleteHalo Anonymous September 28, 2015 at 9:36 AM
DeleteKažeš da je kompanija dodala dvije dodatne učestalosti/učestanosti odnosno frekvencije. U nastavku kažeš da se broj frekvencija smanjuje.
Iskoristiću ovu priliku da vas opet sve upozorim da bi zbilja trebali naučiti ispravno kristiti pojam frekvencije.
Let nije jednako frekvencija!
Kompanije ne mogu dodati učestalost/učestanost/frekvenciju jer frekvencija predstavlja broj dogadjaja u jednoj sekundi ili nekom drugom, posmatranom vremenskom intervalu.
U MKSA sistemu, jedinica za frekvenciju je obično jedan kroz sekund (1/s=1Hz, Hertz, Herc)
Frekvencija ne može biti dodata ili oduzeta nego se frekvencija uvećava ili smanjuje kada se respektivno povećava odnosno smanjuje broj dogadjaja u posmatranom vremenskom intervalu. Ne mora samo sekunda biti taj interval vremena, mogu to biti i sedmica, mjesec, zimska ili ljetna sezona.
Avio-kompanije dodaju letove na postojeće rute ili dodaju nove rute.
Kad dodaju letove na postojeće, frekvencija raste.
Kad ukidaju letove na postojećoj ruti, frekvencija se smanjuje, u žargonu, frekvencija pada.
Frekvencija nekog dogadjaja dakle može biti: 2 puta sedmično, 3 puta mjesečno, milion puta u sekundi.
Dakle, kad kompanija ustanovi novu liniju, ista ne može reći da je dodala još jednu frekvenciju!
ot
Good luck Air Serbia,
ReplyDeleteHowever, I would like to hear this news confirmed By Mr. Hogan or Kondic.
+1
Delete+1000
DeleteDon't be naive - ASL is PMs personal project and he has a lot of vested interest in it. Political, rather than financial, just to be clear. He was aware of the Board meeting yesterday and keeps a close eye to developments there. "We will be flying to JFK" is different from very precise five weekly plan.
DeleteI'm not saying this is good or bad and really don't wan't to go into politics, but simply, if he said it - that's what ASL is doing. The real question is - who made the call in the first place, not who broke the news.
@11:56 Vučić je samo preuzeo Dinkićev projekat. Dinkić je "doveo" Etihad.
DeleteWhat exclusive news. EX-YU, thank you for keeping us updated. Everyone in Serbia should be proud of Air Serbia achievements.
ReplyDeleteGet ready to give even more of your taxes to Air Serbia.
ReplyDeletethose flights are going to be a financial disaster!
Cekaj vama je EU zabranila da vise finansirate propale kompanije AA i CA koje i dalje traze kupca dok cemo mi finansirati jos par godina letove za USA. Mislim jasno ti je da ste finansirali budaletine za nista, mi cemo mozda imati letove preko bare za taj novac. Jasno je valjda ko je na dobitku.
DeleteMeni je drago da u ovom bezosecajnom svetu ima toliko zabrinutih ;)
DeleteOn my, it is going to be a very, very bitter Monday.
ReplyDeleteOn the bright side, if all the hate bursts out today we may have a calm rest of the week. The only problem is, the well from which the haters drink simply has no bottom.
Who will finance that?
ReplyDeleteKomšija.
DeleteWhen are we going to have the approval of the Americans for the flights?
ReplyDeleteIskreno, mislim da bi se ASL trebao još širiti po Europi, pa tek onda dodavati prekooceanske letove. Mislim, još niti ne lete u Prištinu, Madrid, Barcelonu itd..S druge strane, nisam siguran hoće li ASL uspjeti uhvatiti previše putnika iz Zagreba za JFK, jer je Zagreb odlično povezan s SAD-om preko British Airwaysa, Air Franceom, Lufthansom, KLM, ljeti i Iberijom, i cijene su prilično povoljne.
ReplyDeleteLetovi za Madrid i BCN nemaju nikakve veze sa letovima preko bare oni imaju svoje direktne letove.
DeleteZa Madrid nema interesovanja za razliku od Katalonije koja je sezonski pokrivena.
Da li ti zaista mislis da ASL sada zavisi od Agrama odakle ljudi slabo koriste avion? Svi su im letovi koji su zavisili od domacih putnika preko bare propali. Samo dobro je da postoji ta mogucnost i neko ce je mozda koristiti.
Pitanje za strucnjake za LF, da li ste ikada na internetu koristili opciju +- 3 dana?
ReplyDeleteСтручњаче
DeleteОпцију +/- 3 дана користе путници којима је цена примарна у одабиру и флексибилан је са својим путовањем.
У питању су најчешће путници који ређе путују. За честе, углавном пословне путнике, који највише путују и пуне авионе, датум путовања је фиксан и ништа му не значи ако дан касније види да је цена нижа или да на онај дан када њему треба да путује нема лета.
Ред летења ЈУ какав је формиран на почетку је асоцирао да ће се развојем компаније доћи до најмање два дневна лета ка сваком од одредишта, а не да ће две године касније доћи до резања линија и фреквенција.
Ја сумњам да се са оваквим редом летења може постићи бољи фактор пуњења, јер џаба путнику из Солуна опција +/- 3 дана и веза до Београда, ако до Стокхолма на пример у распону од 6 дана не може да убоде ни један термин у који се уклапа, било редом летења, било ценом. Компанија тада губи не само путника на лету за Стокхолм до кога је смањила фреквенције, већ и путника од Солуна до Београда. Такво скрнављење реда летења се не може сматрати мерама које ће подстаћи повећање попуњености.
Везано за прекоокеанске летове, дошло је из уста пицоустог, после се његови следбеници овде буне када кажемо да се компанијим управља у Немањиној улици, а да је Кондић само марионета
@11:26 JU proporcionalno ima najmanje biznis putnika na koje si se vidim fokusirao u svom "elaboratu".
DeleteZnači, po tebi, je svaka pohvala i pozitivna vest o ASL znak sledbeništva vlasti?! Kapiram da si razočaran da im ide dobro ali mislim da bi svoje frustracije politikom trebalo da lečiš na drugom mestu. Što se tiče opaske o Kondiću, verovatno je po tebi i sam Etihad Vučićeva marioneta.
Tebe cemo poslati da branis interese ASL u EU.
DeleteNema previse poslovnih putnika za USA. Stepen industrijske i trgovacke razmene sa celim regionom je dosta nizak. Nikome ovde nije problem da otputuje i dva dana ranije. Prezaposleni poslovni ljudi kako da ne. Smanji malo dozivljaj.
For flights to USA to be successful ASL needs a strong feeder network.
ReplyDeleteO&D JFK-BEG year round is very small.
It needs connections to Albania, Montenegro, Croatia, Bosnia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary, Czech Republic, Ukraine, Georgia, Armenia, Turkey, Greece, Cyprus, Lebanon, Israel and Egypt at a minimum.
"Turkey, Israel and Egypt" svi imaju svoje letove za USA. Grcka u letnjem periodu sa Deltom. Sa ostalima ima dnevne letove ASL, ali njih treba jednog dana da usaglasi sa letovima preko bare. Ukrajina i kavkaske republike ne verujem da ima interesa da lete uopste.
DeleteDon'' forget local JFK feed as well for the return leg
DeleteGreece, Turkey, Israel and Egypt have a LOT of O&D demand to US all year round.
DeleteJU needs to get even a small part of that to fill its planes to JFK.
Lufthansa, Austrian, Alitalia already use those passengers despite having large home markets.
JU will need them even more.
Also Ukraine (40 million population) and Armenia (very large diaspora) have a lot of demand for the US.
JU can not be profitable flying to the US by competing only for ec-Yu and rest of Balkans passengers.
Of course all those matter if JU wants to be profitable flying to North America.
It can always fly either half empty planes or fill them with super discounted fares and have losses covered by the State and EY.
Pricas totalne besmislice to moze da radi samo LH koja puni A380 avione. Svaki od ovih letova do Beograda kosta puno novca to bi udavilo ASL. Ebavati se sa Ukrajinom i Azerbejdzanom radi prekookeanskih je bezveze. Druga je prica sa tehnickim stopom u BEG. U okolnim zemljama ima dovoljno putnika i za LH i za ASL. to je samo 1200 putnika nedeljno.
DeleteAnon 3:25
Delete+1000
5 weekly flights from next year to NY, I'm sorry to say but this for me already sets off alarm bells.
ReplyDeleteIt really makes no sense unless it it Etihad flying to NY 5 times per week via Belgrade??
Time will tell.
So? so nothing if you're happy with 5 empty flights to NY from Belgrade per week.
DeleteIf Air Serbia does start flying to NY next year I doubt it will be 5 times per week but like I said, time will tell.
Interesting. There is supposed to be a free market out there where anyone who dares to try transatlantic may get his chance. And so various carriers try their luck on these routes every year.
DeleteAnd yet, it is only ASL that gets bashed and sent straight into predicted emptiness and bankruptcy before any flights have even been confirmed and scheduled. Anytime a smaller airline opens a transatlantic route we hear applauding and "good luck" comments. But when we unofficially hear something similar from ASL the avalanche is triggered immediately: they cannot be cheaper than LH, no one will fly them, 5x frequency is a suicide, there are so many options in FRA/AMS/LHR...
Well since you are all such impartial genius minds, would you tell me why would ANY AIRLINE other than LH, AF or BA ever bother to try transatlantic? I mean, if all customers will use 3 airports and no other place to fly to the US, how come we have smaller carriers from smaller hubs trying it and surviving it right next to the almighty FRA, AMS and LHR?
And event if the entire project does not make it, why not trying? How do you imagine anyone except the EB3 to ever do something if you lash out any newcomer with your "nah, only LH can do that" logic?
Or is it only if the newcomer's name is Air Serbia?
Najveci je problem sto se firma zove Air Serbia i jos jedan problem sto svi srbi u svom umu koju teorije zavere i pljuju sve svoje i ako je najbolje .
DeleteINN-NS
Hmm not true, Sky Greece was also bashed on here and so was that Chicago based carrier that eventually failed a few years ago so no need to be pathetic. Everyone gets treated equally when it comes to stupid ideas.
DeleteAll airlines that currently fly to North America do it because there is considerable demand and because they have a strong partner over there.
DeleteTake SAS, in addition to having a strong hub in CPH they also have a lot of local demand, especially for places like New York.
Finnair has maintained New York flights for years now but they haven't expanded anywhere else and they are just adding Chicago now, primarily thanks to their partnership with AA.
Iberia operates out of Spain and even they experienced difficulties in keeping some north American routes alive (Boston, LAX...).
Swiss is obvious and so is Aer Lingus. Austrian Airlines' New York flight can be sustained alone thanks to the UN on both ends.
They launched Chicago recently which is a huge Star hub and so in IAD.
Then you have airlines like CSA, Malev, Tarom... which have failed for more than obvious reasons.
I hope you can see the difference between all these and Air Serbia. Even if you take LO which has a trumendous O&D potential and which has the most economical aircraft at the moment, experiences huge difficulties.
"Even if you take LO which has a trumendous O&D potential and which has the most economical aircraft at the moment, experiences huge difficulties."
Deletea: geography. Poland has several large cities, all better connected by LH to FRA/MUC than to WAW. LH has better feed from Poland then LO on their own turf. Also, LO alliance partners on the other end AC and UA are in JV with LH, not LOT.
b: most economical (but expensive) plane does not mean much during low oil price period. LO 787 has a wrong configuration for the market. Case in point: Air Canada did not select their top shelf product (new 787) to fight LOT, but instead uses low-end RV 767 without biz class to go underneath LOT, where most of the market is. If there's a takeaway for ASL, it's consider going dense and only Y and Y+.
c: LOT feed for those flights. Until last year LOT was not focused enough on feeding TATL from wider region.
LOT has other internal problems, but they are not TATL specific, like restructuring and growth restictions.
a. WAW on its own should stimulate enough demand in order to fill north American flights, especially since there is also quite a lot of economic activity between the two countries. Also, WAW can attract passengers from southern Poland and places like Krakow so it's not all doom and gloom as you make it sound.
Deleteb. Air Canada will use Rouge to Poland because the market is highly seasonal and low-yielding. LOT might be a legacy carrier but their costs are considerably lower than Air Canada's. AC has to adapt to the realities of the market.
c. until last year? What are you going on about? LO has been flying to places like BUD, OTP, SOF, BEG, SVO, KBP... for many years now and they have been in the business of offering connections for the longest time now, both intra-European as well as long-haul.
Da li ti kapiras da LH gazi sve kompanije koje su u njihovoj grupi? Samo LX ima solidne letove preko bare. To je samo deo problema LOTa.
Deletea: economic activity is year round, and when you look at massive drop in frequency during winter, it shows that biz related demand is there, but much softer than in the West.
Deleteb: agreed. But this also means AC could one day use Rouge on YYZ-BEG to go against Air Serbia. However if ASL cabin is dense and without business class, it makes no sense for RV to go against it, and would more likely partner and codeshare with Air Serbia than go against it.
The A330 that JU will lease from EY wont be a dense Economy cabin without Business class.
DeleteLease from EY is temporary solution and high level of service that ASL will initially offer on leased A330 is needed for initial brand awareness, similar to what current product on Airbus fleet is doing on Europe/Mediterranean routes. However when permanent solution is found for ASL long haul fleet, most likely order for A330NEO or 787, denser configuration without biz class should be considered.
DeleteRight now big US3 are not competing in that space as they enjoying merger benefits, cheap oil and record profits, but they are closely watching LCC developments in the long haul market, from Norwegian, Eurowings, Air Canada Rouge, Westjet etc. They also want to do it right and avoid Song or Ted 2.0. Air Serbia should be ready to adapt to less permium layout in the near future, and market realities point to that outcome. Take a look at Air Canada Rouge 767 with economy, extra legroom economy (for a fee) and premium economy:
https://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/b767-300rouge.html
Дечко Тзар
DeleteNajgora solucija je porudzbina A330 Neo njbolja opcija je A350 zbog buducih razvojnih planova.
INN-NS
boje pustinje?
DeleteNe, Deliblatske pescare.
DeleteJako mi je drago sto je svojom profitabilnoscu i zaslugama svih radnika ASL uspela da nam saopsti ove divne vesti koje potvrdjuju sto ja odavno pricam ovde .
ReplyDeleteI nadam se da ce takodje ubrzo posle uspostavljana linije krenuti jos jedan grad o kome se pricalo.
INN-NS
Dilejo, ASL jos nista nije najavila.
DeleteINN-NS September 28, 2015 at 2:09 PM
DeleteDragi korisnice, da li mozete da mi postavite link, da procitam tu najavu, pokusavao sam da je pronadjem na sajtu ASL i u vestima al nisam uspeo?
Pssst
DeletePa da, imas pravo. Tako smo pricali i za LF na letovima za PEK pa evo sada uvode i 10. let nedeljno.
DeletePa pricatce te da je lf katastrofalan .
DeleteI naravno nadam se jos letova za ORD i YYZ zato sto ce biti profitabilni kao i ovi za JFK.
INN-NS
Letovi nisu ni poceli da se prodaju, a njemu su vec profitabilni.
Deleteon nezna sta je profitabilnost, klinac nema/ima (?) 10 godina skole
DeleteIf (and this is a big if) we consider this news to be correct I’d like to know what’s this leased ac going to do those 2 days it’s not flying. Fly for somebody else, fly somewhere else or just sit on the BEG tarmac? Also, there are couple of things still missing for this to materialize and those are appropriate permits and local code share agreement. None of these would be requirement for the announcement but…
ReplyDeleteAs somebody mentioned above, I’ll trust this news when it comes from Hogan or Kondic not the PM. I really don’t understand why he does these things. It’s not like there are elections around the corner or something. If he wishes well to this company he should do the same they are doing with Smederevo steel mill and that is SHUT THE HECK UP.
Letece za YYZ .
Deleteinn-ns
You would need more than 1 aircraft to fly to NY 5 times per week... at least 2 to maintain those frequencies.
DeleteThis is why I said I doubt if it happens, it will be 5 times per week unless Etihad proper is involved somehow like Abu Dhabi to NY via Belgrade 5 times per week.
Q400
DeleteCan you please elaborate on this, I’d love to know more about how these things work.
To me and in theory, one plane could leave BEG in the morning, be in NA in the afternoon (same day), turn around and be back in BEG the following morning. Now, ac can’t fly every day with no issue for years. So you have to account for planned and unplanned maintenance. Planned maintenance checks could be scheduled for the low season. As a replacement you could arrange short term lease (probably very expensive) or make adjustments to skip those weeks/days. The bigger problem is when there are issues (unplanned) when plane can’t take off. The only way you can take care of this is by rebooking pax onto other carriers (expensive and not good PR). Interesting question would be what’s more expensive. All of this or the lease of an extra ac.
Again, this is just my uneducated guessing. I’d love to know more details about how this type of planning is actually done.
Timing is not right for AUH-BEG-JFK and back, BEG-JFK has to be separate. For a single plane it could be like this: Mon, Tue, Thu, Fri, Sat. Two days out of seven is not good for utilization, there might be other regional rotation planned for those days.
DeleteProblem is when you do not have enough money or big company with same machine to support you. Exactly case of SkyGreece Airlines.
Delete+1
DeleteDoes anyone have proof that JU is taking 1 wide body? does anyone have an official schedule from JU?
DeleteJATBEGMEL they will call you a hater for asking these questions.
DeleteJbt dogovorite se vise ko upravlja sa ASL Kondic ili Vucic.
ReplyDeleteHogan.
DeleteVucic.
DeleteJa se nadam da upravlja vlada Srbije na celu sa Vucicem posto je vecinski vlasnik I ima pravo da donosi odluke a ne da to bude samo Etihad. Svaka cast, dosta nas u americi jedva ceka te letove.
DeleteProcitajte ugovor pobogu.. 5 godina kompaniju vodi Etihad, aloo..
DeletePa upravo tako, vi iz Amerike se nadate kako u Srbiji nesto treba da bude. Vi ste svoje rekli kad ste otisli za boljim zivotom, mi koji smo ostali ovde treba da se nadamo ili da brinemo, to je nasa stvar sada...
DeleteSerbia would go bankrupt a long time ago if it wasn't for Diaspora sending billions and also visiting often (Serbian "tourism").
DeleteAlthough I like to observe and wish my country of birth success, I realize that the biggest thing holding Serbia back isn't some western conspiracy against it, but rather a primitive society and mentality, such as those who are upset with people emigrating.
Just from my recent visit to Serbia a few weeks ago, I realize how disorderly and messed up the entire country still is. I could never live there again. Empty bottles and garbage everywhere, people crossing the street anywhere to catch a tram, graffiti and vandalism, everything destroyed and no respect for public property.
My family moved away because we are unable to tolerate living in such disorder. Until the people who continue to live in Serbia change their mentality, there can be no progress.
Well, I don't know how we will survive without you here and without the billions you send back. lol
DeleteSorry pal, it's not like we survive here thanks to the charity send from the other side of the ocean.
Lol a huge part of the economy of Serbia is completely designed to cater to Serbs living outside Serbia, including Air Serbia.
DeleteRemittance is a huge part of the Serbian economy. In 2004 Serbia got more remittance than PAKISTAN, BRAZIL, and EGYPT. Without those $4.200.000.000 that year Serbia would be on the same level as Albania.
True that, it's not only what diaspora sends back.
DeleteIt is also billions of dollars of borrowed money. New billions every year, the mountain just keep piling up.
Alas, one day those who left the country will die. Their children will be born abroad and will have no wish to send the cash back to anyone.
Even before that, the international loan window will close. There will be nowhere to borrow more billions.
Then you will see who you are and where you are.
This btw comes from a sad Serb who was born and raised in Serbia so no need to counterattack Croatia.
Ko upravlja? Pa MI. Sve ovonovodosle iz kojekakvih vuko...bina da nas unaprede, jednog po jednog eliminisemo. Vrlo brzo cemo biti ono sto smo bili i ranije.Pa nismo MI dali i dusu i telo godinama za ovu kompaniju da nam sad neki sa strane uvode red. E nece moci. Jedanog smo upravo eliminisali, sad idemo dalje.
DeleteAnon 10:20,
DeleteDon't worry, there will be fresh diaspora and fresh Gasterbajters as long as Serbia stays like this.
One of the best investments Serbia can do is to educate students so they can move away and then send money back.
It took a guy from the diaspora to come back and fix the airline - something that successive "local talent" simply couldn't and didn't have it in them to do ....
DeleteLet's not start talking about that certain bully from Down Under. He is the worse kind of Serbian diaspora. Also, without local political will that chap couldn't do much. That was one of the reasons JU kept on failing all these years. Not because there was no talent but because there was no political will.
DeleteAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA OMGGGGGG
DeleteGive us a break. I love how all those self-righteous members of diaspora nag and bitch.
Hey, you left Serbia. Forget about it now and move on.
You are as bad as those who you spit on. If you really cared about Serbia you would stop sending money because you are helping keep the system alive.
AUSSIE AUSSIE AUSSIE - OI OI OI !!!
DeleteAnon at 11.11pm - he's the worst kind because he's successful, gets things done and makes people work for their money ... things which Serbs here in Serbia hate and don't and never will understand ...
DeleteAnon @ 11.13pm - those of us sending money, do it to support family and relatives who have no jobs or means to feed themselves. In my case, they are Serb refugees from Croatia who have been doing it tough for the past 20 years .... we don't send money to a political party or to sustain any "system" .... if you really cared about Serbia, you would do something to change the system you are living in because attitudes like yours are helping to keep the system in place
Delete11.11pm anonymous - so what has happened to all this great talent who used to run the company that you speak about ? What has happened to their stellar careers and which major airlines in the world are they running these days ?
Delete1. There is no way with Serb employees other than strict. My family runs a business with 4 employees in America and at first we hired Serbs. This was a big mistake because you cannot be friendly with them or they don't work and they steal and otherwise only make trouble. Hiring them wasn't worth the constant management and oversight so we quickly gave up on that idea because for us it is important for employees to be in control.
Delete2. Diaspora sends money to relatives, not to keep any system in place. The only ones who can change the system are those still in Serbia.
3. Nothing in Serbia is successful without foreign control because Serbs as a nation have a primitive mindset. They do not realize that the only way to achieve the wealth and standards of West Europe and North America is by changing their habits and behavior. It is 2015 and I still saw people smoking inside bus stations, I saw someone simply throw a bag of chips onto the ground, and other anti-social behavior.
Aleksandar Stojanovic
Delete+1000
Dok tako Aca sere i morgidzari Srbi koje pljuje zive u svojim stanovima u svom vlasnistvu. Cetri radnika ne mozete da kontrolisete? Jadnici.
DeleteINN - NS
ReplyDeleteOld December 23rd, 2014, 11:07 PM:
Drage kolege, moj prvi post
Dugo vas pratim, moze se reci preko 4 godine "spijuniram" i sve kazem sebi necu se pridruziti ovoj zajednici posto jednom kad udjes u ovo kolo tesko se iz njega izlazi, ali jednostavno prica je toliko atraktivna da moram i ja da se ukljucim i kazem svoje misljenje u vezi Air Serbia-e.
Prvo, sto se tice cirilice na avionima, to mozemo da zaboravimo i topic je potpuno bespotreban, samo zauzima mesto na temi. Cirilice NECE BITI i treba s tim da se pomirimo...Air Serbia prerasta u TRANZITNOG prevozioca putnika i u feeder-a za Etihad i kao takva suvise je mala i beznacajna da bi trazila a i dobila od pravog vlasnika taj "luksuz". Cak i kad smo bili JAT sve je bilo latinica, pa se niko nije bunio.
Druga stvar je povecanje flote
Tu sam sebi dao oduska posto pratim razvoj i Etihada a i Air Serbia-e. Takodje sam pricao sa puno ljudi koji rade za Air Serbia-u i koji su vezani direktno za flight management i crafts purchasing i informacije su sledece (mada to ovde vec svi znaju ali nije lose opet ponoviti) -
1. stize 10 A320neo, to vec i vrapci znaju
2. 737 uskoro ide u penziju
3. Etihad prebacuje na Air Serbia minimum 2 A340-500 i 4 A340-600, barem se tako prica i onda krece luda ekspanzija interkontinentalaca preko Beograda, za A330 jos je stand-by
4. flota VRISTI za dodatnim ATR avionima ali niko ne zna ZASTO Etihad potpuno ignorise Air Serbia-ine zahteve za ATR. Da ih ima tri puta ovoliko ne bi bilo dosta posebno kad krenu interkontinentalni letovi pa se pojaca potreba za ranojutarnjih dolascima u Beograd
Treca stvar je isplativost kompanije - cekaju se finansijski izvestaji ali rezultati, barme koliko sma ja imao uvida u kretanja stanja na racunima su i vise nego zadovoljavajuci...nema profita samo je pozitivna nula ali je i ona ogroman uspeh
Cetvrta stvar je uvodjenje novih ruta - ovde mora da se obrati paznja GDE leti Etihad i gde Etihad planira da leti...Ako Etihad vec leti za Sao Paolo nece pustiti Air Serbia-u da leti isto za Sao Paolo.
Evropa - bez ikakvih ustrucavanja mogu sledece destinacije (neke od njih su vec u pregovorima, neke od njhi su vec zakljucene...) - Barselona (pregovori), Lisabon (pregovori sa TAP da TAP ukine a Air Serbia preuzme), Nica (od zime 2015), Oslo (od zime 2015), St Petersburg (od zime 2015), Helsinki (pregovori), Riga (pregovori), Pristina (krece VALJDA od maja...)
Afrika - cim stignu sirokotrupci krece jedna od sledecih destinacija posto su one jako bitne i Etihadu za dalje konekcije preko Beograda za Abu Dabi - Kejp Taun ili Abidzan ili Akra ili Luanda...najverovatnije Luanda prva pa Kejp Taun drugi
Azija - MOZDA samo Ulan Bator posto sve ostalo drzi Etihad, sve ce ici preko Abu Dabija, moramo biti realni, jedino cemo dobiti MOZDA Peking ali sa Air China-om
Americki kontinent - najveci zalogaj, najveci rizik ali i najveca dobit - vecina je vec povezana sa Abu Dabijem tako da 100% ide Majami i Atlanta u prvom talasu a posle toga NAJVEROVATNIJE Otava, Meksiko Siti i u nekoj daljoj buducnosti Rio de Zaneiro ili Buenos Aires (mada oni lakse idu konekcije preko Lisabona pa dalje TAP).
Toliko od mene za sad. Puno planova, puno novih delivery-ja od strane Etihada, puno posla i nadamo se svi puno profita na kraju krajeva, zato je Air Serbia i stvorena.
U zadnje 4 godine sam imao preko 150 letova i sveukupno preko 600 sati sa raznim kompanijama, kako u ekonomskoj tako i u biznis klasi... u ekonomiji trenutno na kracim i srednjim relacijama NEMA BOLJEG POSLUZENJA od posluzenja u Air Serbia avionima. U biznis klasi je Air Serbia bez premca...ne govorim zato sto je VOLIM (firma kao firma, samo da me preveze od tacke A do tacke B), nego realno.
Takmicimo se sa Azijom po posluzi to je tacno, ali na teritoriji Evrope postajemo prepoznatljivi po dobroj hrani.
Unapred se izvinjavam ako sam pravio neke slovne greske, spreman sam za Vasa dalja pitanja ili komentare
sada si dobio mali milion hejtera.
DeleteWait... who posted that back then?
DeleteFenomenalno ;) znaci, cekamo: Kejp Taun, Abidzan, Akru, Luandu, Ulan Bator, Peking, Majami, Meksiko Siti, Bueno Sajres... jako mi je zao za ovaj SaoPaolo ;) Mali, ovo je bilo dosta pre nego sto si naucio kodove jel?
DeleteE sada, ako vama koji se dopisujete sa njim OVO nije dosta onda mislim stvaaarnoooo...
Ne znam koja je svrha meni obracana kad ja to nisam pisao.
DeleteINN-NS
..pa da.. fake.. suvise je pimeno.
DeleteLast anon,
Deletehahahahha na to sam i ja prvo pomislio. Odmah mi je bilo sumnjivo jer nema klasicnih gresaka koje Marko inace pravi. Ko zna, mozda je pisao uz pomoc recnika, ipak je prvi put pisao.
A ipak je on najpopularniji komentator na ovom blogu, a vi mu samo pridajete na popularnosti svojim konstantnim jadikovanjem o tome kako pise gluposti umesto da ignorisete.
DeleteImajte u vidu da se svadjate sa jednim klincem i samo mu dajete vise povoda da pise sta pise a posle kukate, isti ste k'o i on.
Није тачно, брате, док је био ЈАТ ревија је била на ћирилици.
Delete@ anonymous 12:19am
DeleteJat nova revija was initally in latinca, a few years later it became in cyrillic. Jat had all their billboards and adds in latinica. All their products were written in latinica. All signage when in Serbian on the aircraft was in latinica.
JU should get at least two aircraft to fly transatlantic reliably.
ReplyDeleteRemember what happened to SkyGreece when it's only aircraft had technical issues in Toronto and Montreal.
Vucic has said JFK 5 per week. JU has said nothing.
DeleteThere is no info on the ac they will use, amount they will use, nothing really.
Gdje je avion Vucko? Pricas o avionu a nigdje ga nema. Nece biti nista od JFK, ovo je samo prazna prica tradicionalna Balkanska. Kao prvo nije moguce za JFK od BEG letiti 5 puta sedmicno tamo vamo sa jednim avionom kao drugo Vucko ocito pokazuje sa svojom izjavom da ne zna nista o avio industriji i kako se letovi uzpostave i da nije vec samo tako da se uvede novu destinaciju a to veoma dobro pokazuje kad misli da je samo jedan avion dovoljan. Jos hoce i Chicago i Toronto. Za to mu treba 4-5 Airbus A330 a da bi jos bilo profita nije 2 dnevna leta za ZAG, 2 za Ljubljanu, jedan jedini za SJJ, jedan za Tiranu, 1-2 za Skopje i talp dalje dovoljno za transfer putnike. A takoder 10 Airbus A319/320 i 5 ATR nije dovoljno, treba tu barem 30-40 aviona ili kao Aegean 44 aviona za evropske letove!
ReplyDeleteAegean ima duplo vise aviona nego Air Serbia, mnogo bolju evropsku mrezu i pokriva mnogo veci dio Evrope a jos nisu ni pomislili na SAD ili Kanadu a Air Serbia nastala prije manje od 2 godine a politicari i braco na ovom blogu u komentarima vec prica o SAD/Kanada i Airbus A330. Svaki drugi dan politicari pricaju o ovim letovima i svaki drugi dan se pitaju koja ce destinacija biti prva a braco mali iz Srbije svaki dan i svaku noc spominje letove koji samo sto se nisu zapoceli i koji se svake sekunde trebaju uvesti.
A sto se tice LJU i ZAG, a takoder i SJJ. ZAG ima brojni kompanija koji kroz transfer nude letove preko bare (par puta dnevno, ne 5 puta sedmicno) i nece nikada vise biti onako puno putnika iz ZAG preko BEG kao prije ratova i raspada Jugoslavije, LJU takoder je isto dobro spojena sa Star Alliance hubovima a ono putnika sa SJJ sto lete preko bare imaju odlicne mogucnost sto se tice letova za SAD/Kanada preko Istanbula. A tu je i Austrian Airlines i Lufthansa a sada i Swiss.
Ja vjerujem a mislim da je i realno tako misliti, da Air Serbia nece napredni 15-20 godina imati Airbus A330 u floti i da nece biti letova preko bare a mozda njih nece nikada ni biti barem dok smo mi ovdje prisutni. Takoder i Croatia Airlines je malena i nista nece ni s njima biti, jedino ako bude kao Air Transat neka kompanija ili neka kompanija na putu za SAD sleti u ZAG i pokupi putnike. Inace nazalost ne.
Aegean ima jos pored BEG i Srbije prednost sto se tice turista, Grcka je na drugom nivou sto se tice turista i pogotovo americki turista uporedeno sa Srbijom a takoder Grcka ima mnogo vise americki turista i vise mora nego Hrvatska a i jeftinija je. Ako iko na Balkanu ima realnu mogucnost za SAD/Kanada letove i koji moze imati profita s tim letovima to je Aegean pored Turkisha.
DeleteNazalost, kompanije iz bivse Jugoslavije su malene za tako velike stvari. Jedno je JAT Yugoslav Airlines bilo, jedno je Air Serbia i Croatia Airlines.
+1000
DeleteAegean has 44 A320/21 and also14 Q400 but still doesn't try to fly to the US despite having a much bigger hub in ATH than JU in BEG.
Probably because it operates as a business instead as a political project.
“ono putnika sa SJJ sto lete preko bare imaju odlicne mogucnost sto se tice letova za SAD/Kanada preko Istanbula”
DeleteOcigledno nisi koristio ove letove niti si skoro konsultovao geografsku mapu. Ako se malo pogeldas shvatices zasto I pored dobrih cjena nasi ljudi izbjegavaju transfer via IST ako ikako mogu (4-5 extra sati leta plus ocajan transfer u IST). ZRH je opcija iz US, ne iz Kanade. Pored ovih kao sto si pomenuo imas samo LH/OS via MUC/VIE. Sobzirom da su LH, LX I OS prakticno jedna kompanija, imaju virutalni monopol na ovom trzistu koji se reflektuje u cjenama (SJJ tradicionlano najskuplja destinacija u exYU).
Za razliku od Olimpica koga je apsorbovao Aegean radi na drugom biznis modelu na koji treba da se ugleda CA, ali valjda vam je Kresimir pametniji.
DeleteATH announced today that if passenger numbers keep on growing this winter season, the airport will start working on the construction of a new terminal.;)
DeleteI wouldn't be surprised if Aegean gets its own terminal, just like Olympic Airways had its own back at Elliniko.
I don't think dedicated terminal is possible at ATH at this point. They plan on adding a satellite terminal, if I'm not mistaken.
DeleteThe main terminal building in ATH can easily expanded on the left side.
DeleteIt is designed that way, it doesn't even has walls on than end only glass windows.
There is already a satellite terminal on the right side with jet bridges that they started using again two years ago.
This year they expect record passenger traffic of 18 million+.
When it comes to ATH there are several ways in which it can expand.
Delete1. They can bring back the pre-crisis plan for the small satellite terminal when they wanted to link it to the main terminal building. This could be a good move given the increased number of flights to non-Schengen countries.
2. On the other side of the terminal where the remote stands are, there is room between them to place another two satellite terminals.
3. Finally, there is space on the other side of the parking where a whole new terminal can be built. This was all part of the mega plan from about a decade ago.
The management said that they will look into various different ways in which they can expand the capacity. In my opinion they will go for the expansion of the non-Schengen area as it can get quite crowded during peak hours. Also, it's worth mentioning the Aegean has announce quite a few non-Schengen flights for next summer so they will need all the space they can get.
Athens management will first of all discuss this with Aegean as they are their most important customer there.
I found a nice rendering of the master plan for the expansion of ATH.
DeleteWith the light blue roof are the future terminal expansions. With the white roof in the front and on the right side of the tower is the present terminal:
http://www.naco.nl/assets/images/Projects/EU/GR_ATH_Athens-april-2006-3D-01-cropped.jpg
That plan is from 2006 while ATH did change its owners in 2013. It will be interesting to see how the Canadians handle the situation there. In my opinion they are so much better and efficient than HOCHTIEF was. They kept on ripping airlines off without much will to support airlines that fly into Athens.
DeleteSince the Canadians took over, Singapore Airlines returned under new terms and conditions. Aegean got much more support. Ryanair started flying out of Athens etc.
A3 has 44 ac, but it also has 3 hubs (ATH, SKG, LCA) and 6 focus cities (CHQ, CFU, HER, KLX, KGS, RHO) where the ac is spread out. JU has 1 hub (BEG). In our region, JU is the third largest airline (1 - TK, 2 - A3) with 15 ac and capacity to grow (CLF ~70%).
DeleteCapacity can quickly increase both ac and routes. ZAG was announced 1 month before launch with 2 daily flights from day 1.
ZAG, LJU, TGD, TIV are year round 2 daily or more. ATH, SKG and SKP are seasonal 2 daily, winter daily. SJJ, TIA and OTP need additional frequencies. DBV and SPU have potential for all year daily. PRN is on the bucket list. ZAD and BWK are looking for connections to BEG.
Lets not forget that althought A3 and TK have an extensive network in Europe, many pax still fly via BEG to European destinations. JU could easily facilitate pax for SJJ, TGD, TIV, OTP, SOF, ATH, SKG, TIA, SKP, VAR, LCA, IST, LJU, DBV, SPU, BNX, BEY, TLV. And thats not adding any new destinations, just more ac and a possible touch up of the timetable, which isnt unrealistic to expect.
A3 has 58 aircraft and is getting another 4 new A320s before next summer season.
DeleteAustrian has 80 aircraft.
TK has almost 300 aircraft!
And they are all profitable.
JU on the other hand has to radically reduce winter flying and can not even facilitate, easily or not a single route to Ukraine or Egypt.
How is it going to compete with them?
How is it going to fill up an A330 to JFK?
Offer 300€ tickets? For how long before it goes bankrupt?
I dont think the reduction is as radical as much as they have grown. WAW, BUD, OTP, SOF, ZAG, BEY, PRG, LJU, TIA, VAR and AUH were opened roughly 1 year from day 1 of JU. This is minus to frequency upgrades to existing routes. Theyve tried, something is working, something is not.
DeleteI bet you mention Ukraine and Egypt due to KBP and CAI not opening from the original plan?
BEG has a demand for JFK, just as to how much daily is something Ive been trying to unsuccessfully google. AUH currently has a decent amount of transit pax on it, so I am certain JFK would have a healthy transit load.
Remember, the ex-YU is not really well connected to transatlantic destinations and there is room for another player. It is dominated by Star Alliance who charge quite a bit, giving SJJ as an example compared to BEG who has a bit more variety.
As for A3, Greece has a huge tourism which for sure A3 has a decent slice of. European tourists bound for example Santorini will not be in need of ATH-JFK flights. Once again, the 58 ac (including OA) is spread out of several hubs and focus cities.
Actually, small correction regarding Aegean. The airline has hubs in Athens, Larnaca, Rhodes and Heraklion. Thessaloniki is a focus city as no aircraft or crew are based there, all flights out of SKG are operated by the aircraft that fly the ATH-SKG segment.
DeleteAs far as last summer goes (2015), A3 had roughly 1.5 aircraft based in LCA, 1 in RHO and 3 in HER.
For quite some time now there were rumours that Aegean might start its own long-haul flying. However, Aegean knows that they are not ready for such a move as their hub system leaves a lot to be desired.
One advantage that A3 has (and that JU failed to achieve) is that it cooperates with many different airlines in Athens. Some of them are Turkish Airlines, Egyptair, Singapore Airlines, SAS...
In my opinion, the main difference between JU and A3 is that JU is doing everything more or less on its own (+ Etihad) while Aegean has partnered up with many different carriers, as mentioned above. It's also worth mentioning that Aegean has good cooperation with both Qatar and Etihad despite both being on bad terms with Lufthansa, one of Aegean's most important partner.
What no one has mentioned until now is that in the past year and a half, Aegean's A321 fleet has doubled from 4 to 8 aircraft. In 2015 they will receive another A320, bringing the total fleet to 36 aircraft. Older birds are operating out of HER and RHO while their newest ones have been flying quite a lot out of Larnaca- which makes a lot of sense.
JATBEGMEL I mention Ukraine and Egypt because they are two countries with very large populations and greatly under-served to USA and Canada.
DeleteBelgrade geographically is ideal for connections from those countries to North America.
It is also ideal for connections from other M.E countries like Cyprus, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia. Kuwait, Jordan, Iran and also from Caucasus countries of Armenia and Georgia who despite large expatriate populations in America do not have direct flights.
Hungary as well.
JU needs to connect all those countries reliably with BEG to feed it's transatlantic schedule.
Instead it tries to build a house starting from the roof!
OT: Not sure if this was mentioned before, but some more news on the new control tower at BEG. Also, congratulations to Serbia & Montenegro air traffic control for coming on top as the best control in Europe.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.b92.net/biz/fokus/intervju.php?yyyy=2015&mm=09&nav_id=1038298
Jat Airways is still the owner of YU-ANJ (photo taken 03/26/2015). Hahahahahaha....ha! - Long live JAT in our hearts and memories!
Deletehttps://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=652419671570258&set=gm.865854136804294&type=3&theater
Etihad's A332 is a pretty good config for Air Serbia (22J 240Y)
ReplyDeletehttp://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Etihad_Airways/Etihad_Airways_Airbus_A330-200.php
Interesting comment. Since the rumour is of an A332, lets compare the other group airlines:
DeleteAB - 19/279 = 298
AZ - 20/263 = 283
HM - 18/236 = 254
9W - 18/236 = 254
I imagine a layout similar to AB and EY, with the AZ capacity.
Etihad A332 was mentioned several times before as a lease for ASL. If EY ends up being the one, capacity will be 22J+240Y=262
DeleteCompare that with the only officially announced aircraft to fly 2016 between Notrh America and Ex Yu region in 2016: Air Transat A332. Config is 0J+345(Y and Y+ combined).
262 vs 345 for identical aircraft, 32% more seats. Is anyone on this site ready to accept the challenge of comparing A332 CASK for ASL and TS?
Air Transat's A332 has a much lower CASK, but also a much lower RASK potential considering that the config is 9 abreast instead of 8 abreast and their business product sucks.
DeleteJU can't match TS's config because they need to keep Etihad's image up, although I think low fares is actually what most passengers from SE Europe want.
Im sure the A332 will be branded JU and not EY. Config can easily change. If im not mistaken, it was the Etihad group mentioned not necessarily EY itself, however not ruled out.
DeleteHM has 2 A332's from EY in Emirati registration and with a different configuration to EY.
Config can NOT easily change. In fact it is very expensive and therefore it is a long term commitment.
DeleteI'd put my bet on the A333 and not A332 as the most suitable aircraft.
DeleteAir Transat config has lower RASK potential if you fly it between JFK and LHR markets with premium demand. Air Serbia will fly between JFK and BEG.
DeleteSame reason why AA uses A321T with less than 20% floor space for Economy, and more than 80% floor space for premium configs on JFK-LAX routes and not on fictional Chattanooga, Tennessee to Kalamazoo, Michigan line.
Anon 2:18 is right.
DeleteAir Transat and Air Canada Rouge are far more ideal for Summer destinations for tourists and diaspora in Ex Yu, Greece, Italy, North Africa and Spain than luxurious Etihad configured cabins.
I agree with Anon 2:23, ASL should at least consider dropping full flat biz class for A330. Handful of guests that require it could be sent to Alitalia or other partners, but capture all the others.
DeleteDa li si ti mentalno retardiran? Ono malo ljudi koji imaju dovoljno za biznis klasu sami ce odluciti sa kim ce leteti i gde ce presedati ako ASL ne bude ima biznis klasu.
DeleteWill they have metal cutlery on these flights ?
ReplyDeleteOT - when will Croatia Airlines introduce wifi on their flights ?
ReplyDeleteSame time they get their new lounge
DeleteWhere exactly in the new terminal will that be ?
DeleteWhatever happened to the agreement that Montenegro Airlines was supposed to sign with Etihad by summer ? It is now autumn ....
ReplyDeleteVerovatno nisu pristali da postanu deo ASL, lose bi im uticalo na "ne zavisni imidž" države.
DeleteVucic has such chaotic state of mind these days, that i wouldn`t be suprised if he would announce that he himself is going to fly the inaugural flight from BEG to JFK.
ReplyDeleteI ja idem
DeleteMozda ti ides ako te puste iz Laze taj dan.
DeleteA vi znate da ne pustaju iz laze verovatno iz licnog iskustva .
DeleteNe ja idem kad ja hocu
Ako ce da lete 5 puta sedmicno leti, a sto ce da lete zimi 3 puta sedmicno? Sto ce da urade sa ostalim danima? 6 miliona evra a avion ce da stoji na platformi 2 dana sedmicno leti i 4 dana zimi. A gde je ovde novac za kerozin, posade, marketing, aerodromske takse...
ReplyDeleteAegean nema takvih letova, ni TAROM, ni CSA, ni Air Bulgaria, ni Budimpešta, ali nasla se Air Serbia. Gde ce da nadju pare za te letove? Odakle bogamu?
Nothing has been confirmed from JU itself so lets wait. As for timetables, the winter timetable hasnt been finalised as of yet let alone next summer.
DeleteAlso, JU doesnt have an ac neither is the price final. There is a speculation to what it COULD be but no definate answer.
RO is currently slightly smaller than JU is pax numbers, OK is decreasing however has 1 A330 they use for ICN, FB is also smaller than JU. BUD also sees daily widebody service from EK.
Balkans to the US has alot of room for expansion, a monopoly held by the LH group (OS, LX and LH),
Ima se, može se..
DeleteActually that is not true
DeleteTarom 2,34 million pax
Air Serbia 2,30 million pax
Tarom 23 planes
Air Serbia 20 planes
Tarom 76 destinations
Air Serbia 41 destinations
Still no long-haul.
BUD widebody from EK for sure is not a same as widebody to USA.
Aegean with 44 planes, 84 destinations and 10,1 million pax. doesn't even have a plan to open long-haul.
Tarom with 3 more ac managed to handle roughly only 40.000 more pax than Air Serbia. This year JU is estimating 2.5 million pax, how about RO?
Delete1 ac, the A310 (YR-LCB) is mainly used for government, currently in the US.
The 76 destinations I assume you took from wikipedia. listing also the charter and codeshare destinations. Total up the charter and codeshare destinations of JU.
A3 has 3 hubs and 6 focus cities compared to JU with 1 hub. Only 46 is ex ATH and year round. JU has 33 year round destinations excluding BUD and LCA.
BUD has no national carrier unlike BEG. BUD also has 2 seasonal Canadian flights with TS, and next summer with RV. I dont see why we cant include EK to DXB, currently operating their A332 soon to be B77W - daily.
Concerning Aegean 46 are just the international destinations it flies during winter. Add to that 30+ domestic.
DeleteSo that is 80 destinations during the slow season.
Between April and October it flies to 130 destinations total...
46 is actually ALL destinations (including domestic) flown year round. ~70 including seasonal routes. Wikipedia lists several ending but not shown as seasonal. Not sure as to the status of these flights, but included them into the count.
DeleteA3 has 83 destinations or 98 including OA, including the summer season destinations (quite less than the 130).
It's not just about destinations, it's also about weekly frequencies.
DeleteJATBEGMEL you should now better than trusting Wikipedia.
DeleteAegean this summer season was flying in 130 destinations.
They advertised extensively about it.
Wikipedia on the other hand does not even list on Aegean's page the destinations flown by Olympic branded Q400!
Instead of Wiki you should trust the companies webpage and public statements to investors.
Correction on A3, it is not 130 but 134 destinations during high season.
Delete440 daily flights.
https://youtu.be/9_ss-oq1Tig?t=52s
Since when is Aegean part of Ex Yu aviation? We don't discuss Austrian here on almost daily basis, and same should apply for Aegean.
DeleteI think they are discussing ASL competition for same passengers. And also by comparison trying to see if ASL flights to New York will be successful.
DeleteAir Serbia's main competitors are not other Ex Yu carriers but Austrian, Aegean, Turkish and Wizz Air.
We also regularly speak of Turkish Airlines, LOT, Lufthansa...
DeleteI think Tarom is a major competitor JU since it is Skyteam's representative in the Balkan region.
DeleteBut Alitalia's network to the USA from Rome is the most direct competitor to JU for Serbian and American passengers.
JU needs to price those tickets competitively to be successful.
Almost every single day we witness obsession with Aegean, even when it has nothing to do with A3 presence in EX YU area. I am sure that dozens of comments here about Austrian Airlines fleet, routes and plans on almost daily basis would upset most readers. Just because Austrian flies to EX YU countries does not make it a reason to discuss it in detail on a daily basis here, there are other places on the internet for other airlines. EX YU admin, do you agree?
DeleteI do not agree and I think we should also discuss the possibility of Aegean's starting flights to Mykonos and Santorini from BEG for the summer months.
DeleteWhat do you think?
Tarom has great potential and it's network is not bad at all but it is managed like a state owned Balkan airline. It will continue to have losses for the next years.
DeleteOr maybe somebody serious will buy it and run it professionally.
Then ASL will be in trouble.
Does TAROM have metal cutlery?
DeleteThey do in business class. In the back they serve large, tasty sandwiches.
DeleteAnonymous at 3:16 PM
Delete+1
In Economy class Tarom does not offer metal cutlery, only black plastic.
DeleteSandwiches I think are only for domestic flights.
OT - Does Croatia Airlines offer pillows and blankets on its flights ?
ReplyDeletePa u Topcideru radi stamparija
ReplyDeleteDiscussion on today's ex yu news made it to the front page of airliners.net! Congrats admin!
ReplyDeleteOno sto ce sigurno da leti je zdrava pamet. Mada, sve vise sumnjam na neki virus zaborava koji j ubacen na ove prostore, pa se zaboravlja sve sto je bilo pre prekuce. JAT je bio zakon, ali ...
ReplyDeleteUzasno me nervira ta priča o "zaboravljanju", šta treba da radimo, da proglasimo dan ili mesec dana sećanja na JAT?! Jel smo zaboravili Aeroput možda? Ništa nije počelo i završilo se sa JAT-im.
DeleteLet's see how this pans out. Considering that most likely JU will aim and collect bottom of the barrel yields, they will need to have very, very high load factors to make this work. In my opinion, regional network is still too poor to warrant that since point to point demand is not big plus very seasonal with very low corporate and high yield potential. Good luck to JU, they will need it. On a side note, if a politician is announcing and not the airline, it just might be that this may not be purely business driven and justified decision.....
ReplyDeleteIt is a political decision that will result in great loses.
DeleteOf course it wont be Vucic paying for them from his own pocket but everyone else.
500.000 USD per month to rent one A330-200 is veeeery expensive.I
ReplyDelete